helicopper

I don't know if I agree with your blanket statement about no legal restrictions and using membership status to gain access to a location where the public is not permitted. Trespass immediately comes to mind and if you're from the NJ FD and are buffing a fire in the NY FD's area and someone makes a stink you could be charged with trespass - a legal restriction. I'd have to review the statutes but I also think you could get yourself jammed up if you're using department ID to access a scene to which your agency has not been requested. Civil liability is also a major concern and probably a greater exposure than criminal. I'm going to again say there could be legal restrictions and you should consult agency counsel when drafting a policy on the subject.

Though hardly scientific, it does seem that a majority of agencies thus far are providing some level of paid coverage.

I would strongly recommend that you consult with your agency and obtain an opinion from legal counsel, preferably the agency or municipality's attorney - not just an opinion from a "Firehouse/Jailhouse/EMS House lawyer" or even the Chief Officer. I've asked in the past what agencies have written policies about this and the responses (or lack thereof) seem to indicate that most have agencies have no policy on the subject. If you're operating within a crime scene/accident scene or in/on private property and the photos are not taken pursuant to your official duties you may be exposing yourself to liability. If you're in my house because of an emergency call and photography is not part of your official duties, you may need to obtain my permission before taking the photos. The same may be true of other government or quasi-government properties (the Thruway comes to mind; they have special rules and regulations). I would also suggest that it depends on your motivation at the time. If you're taking a quick picture to show the ED staff the mechanism of injury there's probably no big problem. If you're taking photos for a commercial purpose (publication/sale/etc.) there may be more issues regardless of your status - paid/volunteer/on-duty/off-duty/etc. I don't know that receiving a paycheck is the only criteria for your employer (paid or volunteer) owning the photos! If you're using your position to gain access to a scene, the photos may also belong to the employer. This is why a lawyer's guidance is needed! None of this constitutes the LEGAL advice you're seeking and I strongly urge you to obtain true legal counsel before putting yourself out there regardless of the responses in this thread. Given the proliferation of photo equipment and ease of wide distribution of such photos, I would also recommend that agencies adopt a policy concerning photos by members of their department while at a scene to protect them from future liability.

What can be done to improve? OK, here's a wish list... Via the REMSCO and REMAC, establish a response time standard of eight minutes (I believe that's the national standard per ACLS - correct me if I'm wrong) 95% of the time. This will in most places require a crew on-duty, in quarters, staffing the ambulance. If an agency can't do that by themselves, maybe they can collaborate with the agency next door because most places don't have an overwhelming volume. As BFD1054 suggested, perhaps an effort to regionalize EMS "membership" and allow Agency X EMT to ride with Agency Y's driver would also help. If you can't meet this standard with your own people, hire people. If you can't hire people, contract out with an agency to provide you the resources. If you can't do any of the above, time to shut your doors and choose a new community service to volunteer for. I think the majority of "volunteer" EMS agencies have paid personnel these days anyway (Peekskill, Ossining, Valhalla, Hawthorne, Mamaroneck, Larchmont, Port Chester/Rye/Rye Brook, Scarsdale, to name a few) so this isn't such a big stretch. They've recognized their short-staffing and dealt with it. Through QA/QI programs, hold agencies accountable for this response time standard and when the responses are abysmal, report it to the Town/Village Board or City Council and publicize it so everyone knows there's a problem. I happen to agree that regionalization or consolidation of services is a good plan for much of the County and that could be a part of this also. Accountability is the first step in this process. Agency heads can't stick their heads in the ground and deny that a problem exists when they're not getting out the door. How's that for a start?

I too applaud the ones that train and respond to their calls but I don't applaud the ones who can't get out the door and think relying on mutual aid "because we're volunteers" is OK. Complaining about the problem is only the first step in solving it. I don't believe that people here are complaining for the sake of complaining but would really like to see conditions improve and are seeking ideas and support to do it.

True, there are problems in EMS regardless of the system structure but there are fundamental differences in the problems between volunteer and paid services. In the volunteer sector, and the main point of this thread, the issue is that there are volunteer agencies who can not staff the first rig for the first call and that is the problem. Compounding that is the fact the first (and even subsequent) mutual aid agencies can't respond either causing the job to go several agencies deep with no people severely delaying a response! Commercial or other paid agencies aren't having a problem staffing their units, their problem is primarily not having enough units to meet the volume. Different problem. To really complicate this, how much of the increased volume paid agencies are dealing with is mutual aid to volunteers that can't field a crew? Sure, we can discuss your points but it is probably not the same solution for volunteer and paid problems. Nobody here is bashing volunteers. They are merely highlighting problems and throwing the topic out for discussion.

It's not that simple. Fire Districts are political subdivisions and as such have authority to levy taxes and collect money to operate. What you're proposing is the creation of a second fire district to cover an area already covered by the Hillcrest FD. This means that Hillcrest will have to either redraw their district lines or agree to the diversion of funds to a new department. I fail to see why we need to create any more layers of government in NYS. Unless it can be proven that the Hillcrest FD is not meeting its mandate of responding to fire calls in this area, the over-eager volunteers should join Hillcrest and respond to all the calls in the entire Hillcrest district and not just a segment of it. How will they operate on the Sabbath? Will Hillcrest be expected to provide "mutual aid" during this time? There's nothing mutual about that because Hillcrest operates 24/7. If they are so motivated and want so badly to be a part of the system, join the system that exists already. There's no need for a new one!

Training and standardization would correct that! When that cheat sheet got edited incorrectly, did anyone bother to change it to the correct term? Do you want dispatch to interpret your officer's message and act on their interpretation or do you want it to be standardized? If A, then B. If you tell your dispatchers that "people trapped" should add X and Y to the response, they'll do that for you. It has to be standardized though because everyone is going to have their own interpretations of "heavy smoke" unless you tell them what you want when that is transmitted.

Only in mutual aid or regional responses where different radio codes may be encountered. There is nothing wrong with the FDNY, NYPD or YFD using 10-codes during their normal day to day operations. (See attachment below for NIMS Alert on subject) plain_lang.pdf If you want to call the Department of Homeland Security and FEMA "so-called authorities", you'll have to take your argument to Washington, DC. As for plain English or clear text being the cause of your radio chaos, I bet that's not the problem! You can have very unprofessional radio traffic with or without 10-codes. The problem is the lack of a STANDARD for such codes. If there was one statewide standard, we'd have no problem using them but when you have a mutual aid response and one department uses numbers to designate sides of the building and another uses letters and a third uses colors, you're going to run into problems. Or 10-13 means car accident in one town, back in service in another town and officer needs assistance in another, what's really happening. There are many areas using plain English as their standard and they have very professional communications and everyone knows what they mean. The chaos could probably be limited or eliminated with training, discipline, and standardization. If you let people say and do whatever they want you'll invariably wind up with a problem. To those who would blame NIMS for all our problems, you obviously haven't read it! It is designed to reduce confusion, improve communications and coordination, track resources more accurately and efficiently, and insure that information is properly disseminated. That sucks? I think not! I think the institutional resistance to change and the "you can't tell me what to do in my department" mentalities is what leads people to believe that NIMS sucks.

LifeNet didn't stop responding - they simply redeployed their resources. We're still going to have air resources, they're just coming from a different base of operations. Approximate flight time from Harris to Mahopac is 20 minutes; approximate flight time from Valhalla to Mahopac would be about 12 minutes. If Lifeguard was the first up in the rotation flight time would have been approximately 10 minutes from Newburgh to Mahopac so the relocation of the helicopter from Westchester elsewhere is not the only criterion that changes response times. I respectfully disagree with your assertion that this is going to "cost lives". Good EMS is what saves lives, not the vehicle in which that EMS is carried. If the weather prevented a helicopter response we'd provide EMS the same way we always do and the outcome would be a result of the accident not the transport vehicle. As for population density, in my opinion that is exactly why the unit based in Westchester proved to be NOT cost effective. The majority of patients are closer to a trauma center in densely populated areas and don't really benefit from air transport. Conversely, in western Orange County or Sullivan County, the distance to any hospital makes air transport a more desirable option to have available. The LifeNet system does not do any rescue (they are not hoist equipped) or airborne deployment of medical teams (no rappeling or fast roping) so that is erroneous information. The notion that they land in remote areas where ground ambulances can not travel is actually kind of funny - we do live in Westchester County, right? Didn't move to the wilds of Colorado or Wyoming, did we? The NY State Police are hoist equipped and can do rappeling but only of tactical teams, not their flight medics. I don't know if I'd call it fear mongering but it does show how poorly informed people are. Medevacs are truly a regional resource; there is no need to have one in every county or city.

I wouldn't sweat it too much. As was said, the list is good for 4 years and the small class they just put through almost guarantees quite a few hires in the next few classes. A lot of jobs have a lot of positions to fill so best of luck to you!

Has anyone worked with high resolution digital cameras (15+ MP)? Just curious what model(s) you like/don't like etc. Thanks, Chris

Great info, thanks! Is there something in between the Nikon D3 and the other big MP options. I'm looking for a very stable platform that will allow moderate low light use, provide enough clarity for significant enlargement/cropping. Basically I'm looking for the best of both worlds. I'll look into the models recommended so far. Thanks again, everyone!

Yes, an aircrew can be recalled for emergency assignments. "Reasonable" is in the eye of the beholder - I wish we could be airborne instantly but response times will vary due to a variety of things including the nature of the request. Government is a business and decisions have to be made intelligently using a risk vs. benefit, cost vs. benefit analysis. I agree that it would be nice to make more emergency services resources available but it is just too expensive and can not be justified.

From a business perspective - the perspective that we all need to factor in, especially in this day and age - it simply is not cost effective to maintain the helicopter in Westchester. I am sure that LifeNet analyzed this from not only the business angle but others as well and this is their decision, they have no mandate to keep a ship based in Westchester. They will still respond to Westchester when necessary, it will just make the response time a few minutes longer - and make our discussions about the appropriate use of medevacs even more applicable since new response times will have to be factored into the transport decision. We still have more medevac options than a lot of other areas - Lifeguard and LifeNet (Orange County), LifeNet (Sullivan County), NorthStar and the other private operation in NJ (sorry the name escapes me right now), Nassau, Suffolk, LifeStar (Connecticut), State Police out of Albany, MedFlight out of Albany, and so on. Push comes to shove, the NYPD will do limited medevacs also. As for the Westchester County PD doing medevac work, thanks for the thought and for trying to give me more job security but we're a law enforcement and limited fire/rescue operation. Sure, Bell 407's can be used for medevac work but we are not configured as an air ambulance and with all our other mission requirements it is simply not feasible or practical. I would much rather see local police and fire departments use us appropriately for the missions we can do now than try to add another highly specialized mission to our repertoire. That would keep us busy enough! To those who pointed out our limited staffing and availability, you're right. We are not a 24 hour operation and we do have limited personnel but (thankfully) we don't need to be. Of course we could use more personnel and that's being worked on. As for LifeNet's disposition of the aircraft based in Westchester, it will probably be put back into their fleet as a spare or relocated to another station in need. It is one of the older ships unless I've loss track of which one is there now. If personnel are losing their jobs that sucks but hopefully they'll be absorbed into other areas where LifeNet operates. Goose, the divine intervention and remarkable planetary alignment to which you're referring is not as far-fetched as you may believe. Many local agencies in the County were involved with the decision to utilize grant funds to acquire the County's new Bell 407. It can be done, it just has to be presented right (factual not emotional, reasonable not excessive, etc. etc. etc.). I'm sorry to see them go they were a real fixture in Westchester for many years but given the economy I certainly understand the rationale for LifeNet's decision.

Please remember to focus on the issue and keep personal biases and/or discriminatory/antisemitic remarks out of this thread. Such remarks will be deleted immediately. Thank you for your cooperation!

I don't think it has been decided PRACTICALLY, just legally. If mask seal can not be established, they will not succeed in an IDLH environment, thus they will either become secondary victims or fail in their mission to rescue others. If other PPE can not be worn/is not available, they will suffer the same fate. I remember that court decision but does anyone know if that firefighter is assigned to a front line company or if he is assigned elsewhere because of the PPE issue? Though they don't have any type of enforcement authority, the standards from NFPA (and others) is pretty clear and these guys don't come close. There is already a fire department serving this area; if they want to join it, fine. They should not try to start their own.

What does Town/Village law say about establishing a fire department? Aren't there statutory requirements for them and don't they have to meet minimum requirements? I don't think anyone will turn a blind eye to this if it is challenged with facts and good information and not just emotional, though well-intentioned, arguments. PESH is another agency to consider but unless these are "public employees", I don't know if they'll have jurisdiction. The elected body responsible for the Village needs to address this and if they choose to ignore it, then it should be brought to the County Fire Coordinator. The parties involved could also consider legal action if all else fails. If code enforcement is an issue here, then the issue needs to be discussed and resolved by the Town/Village boards and well documented. From purely a practical and safety point of view, there would probably be issues for many of these people to become qualified firefighters because of the incompatibility of PPE with the religious obligations - such as facial hair and other things. If they want to become an FD, they should start the process from the beginning and not just jump into it in the middle by responding to things. As for the license plates, there are a great many vehicles out there that have no business having "official" plates but I doubt we'll see much change there.

As I said, vintage (historical) plates can be registered to a vintage/historical vehicle. Last I checked, '67, '55 and '29 all qualify as historical. If you couldn't find a vintage plate from the right year, you'd have to get a contemporary historical plate. You couldn't take a plate you found or bought and register it on 1999 Astrovan. I should have qualified my comments by saying current license plates, the blue/white ones, can't be bought or sold. Above references from nysdmv.com

That's sad. The QA/QI program should provide follow-up on patient outcome, admission diagnosis, outcome, etc. How else do we know that things are working the way that they should or that we're making the correct clinical judgements? Interesting data on the medication assisted intubation. Got any links to the studies or papers? This may be another great example of misinformation becoming fact in the field because the QA/QI and training programs aren't countering bad information with good information. This may show the notion that calling for a helicopter to deliver advanced airway management isn't the best course... The plot thickens! So, good BLS management of an airway in a trauma patient may be preferable to aggressive ALS interventions - what is that pesky concept they try beating into paramedics from day one of training??? What is that again? Oh yeah, BLS before ALS!!! There are more differences between Level 1 and 2 trauma centers and I don't think all level 1 trauma centers have burn units - those are separate and distinct specialties. As for your comments on your experience - I agree that if you have to use a remote landing area that requires extrication and packaging, then transport to the LZ, assessment and treatment by the flight crew, transfer to the aircraft, start-up and take-off, it may be more expeditious to load the patient at the scene and go straight to the nearest appropriate facility (whether local hospital, Level 2 Trauma Center, or Level 1). I'm so glad there are still medics out there who do their work enroute. It used to make me crazy sitting on a scene for 20 minutes when we could have been moving. I know it's not always appropriate or possible but 90% of what we do can be done on the go. This thread has taken a few different turns but I don't think it's been hijacked. It has been a lively and interesting conversation (except for khas of course ) about EMS issues.

Thanks for the info. With regard to FAST Company operations, do they have/use TICs as part of their SOG? I imagine that there are circumstances where they could identify hot spots during their recon that are as yet undetected. Just curious.

I believe that it's from 11PM or midnight until 5 AM that they ride two to a car. It is contractual and was done for officer safety several years ago.

Hence the reason we need better oversight and accountability!

How'd they find it? Did they use a TIC?

Another story on the subject...