helicopper

I think it is already here. Police and Fire budgets are already under scrutiny, vacancies aren't being filled, positions are being eliminated through attrition and outright layoffs of personnel and the closure of fire stations/companies.

There is too a real tangible benefit from the amount of time these personnel spend together. It is very hard to identify and come to respect "the senior guy" if you see him for just a few hours a couple of times a month. Conversely, the people who are spending 40 or more hours together every week come to develop bonds and relationships that are very unique and long-lasting. I'm not saying it can't be done in the former setting but it is much harder. There used to be a similar "senior guy" in law enforcement but it is truly being made a thing of the past. There was always the guys on the tour who could be relied upon to be where the Sgt. wasn't and to make expectations clear (sometimes VERY clear) to newer guys. These guys would also carry the tradition and history of the department to insure that the legacy of their service was not forgotten. Sadly, there are a precious few of these remaining and the culture of law enforcement seems to be very intolerant of these types of leaders.

Date: 4-11-10 Time: 1450 Location: Area of Sky Acres Airport / Oswego Road - Unionvale Frequency: DC911 Units Operating: DCSO, Unionvale FD and EMS, FAA/NTSB, State Police (LifeGuard) Weather Conditions: clear Description Of Incident: Single engine plane crash shortly after take-off from Sky Acres Airport Reporters: Writer: Chris192 This is the second crash near this airport in less than a month. http://www.poughkeepsiejournal.com/article/20100411/NEWS01/100411005/Greenwich--Conn.--man-crashes-plane-in-Union-Vale

The headline makes it sound as though it's some kind of windfall or "found money". There are 27 cops sharing that 2M per year for an average salary of 74,000. That's not an abnormally high or unreasonable salary for a police officer. The system sucks. I've watched disabled colleagues languish while waiting for a determination that never comes while restricted to their homes because they're out injured. Some with seemingly insignificant injuries get retired immediately while others with debilitating injuries and no hope of recovery are made to endure exam after exam and test after test all with the same result. Yes, the system is broken. Yes, it needs to be streamlined.

Thank you.

Let me rephrase the question... Why use master streams over hand lines on a brush fire?

Meanwhile the program to train local cops/deputies so they can enforce immigration violations still goes on around the US. Arpaio was just a little to zealous for the liberal, scared of their own shadow, elected/appointed hacks in DC.

The last thing we need are more computers. They're only going to be of limited help and now we're going to saddle the IC or his/her designee with typing and tracking and making sure it worked right? Come on. The best way to request resources is to (as others have so aptly described) get on the radio and say: "Transmit a second alarm" or "Special Call 3 tankers" or "Request an additional engine and truck mutual aid and make the truck a tower ladder". The fully qualified dispatcher acknowledges and you're done. Sometimes less is more and technology isn't the best answer. While there are some eminently qualified and experienced dispatchers there are also some real slugs out there (this is not directed at 60-Control but rather Communications in general) and if you listen to radios long enough you'll hear the good the bad and the ugly.

Amazing how the media leapt to conclusions and got it completely and totally wrong. Diplomatic immunity is just that, immunity. The State Department could revoke his credentials and declare him a persona non grata to make sure he stays out of this country but we'll have to see what our "kinder and gentler" administration wants to do with this moron.

Governor's Island closed several years ago. Now all the air assets come out of either Atlantic City or Cape Cod so their response time is not good. The New York State Police also do hoist operations so they are a good "plan B". The reality is that if it is not life-threatening it is going to be a ground op though. Nobody should put a helicopter at risk for a knee or ankle injury.

When on-duty we are dispatched like any other unit, right over the air. When not on-duty, we are subject to recall. Yes, the Bell 407 has a hoist and thermal imaging camera and we do have a stokes basket. Not that we're going to rush into a hoist rescue if it is just a matter of "convenience". There will be a risk/benefit analysis and if hoisting is the best option and it is feasible, it will then be considered. Was this victim gravely injured? The best use of the helicopter in this scenario would have been to expedite locating the victim. Of course in a few more weeks when tree cover fills in, that will be much more difficult. As for transporting the victim to the medical center, we would not have done that. We would have extracted the victim from the woods and delivered him to a waiting ambulance for transport to a hospital. We are not, repeat again for anyone who may miss it, NOT a medevac operation. STAT-Flight does not have hoist or thermal imaging capability. They are an air ambulance not a rescue aircraft. This is not a knock on STAT-Flight at all; it is just acknowledgement of their capabilities. They are not the right resource for a woodland rescue. As for the NYPD, they have their own area and call volume to cover so there would have to be a very compelling reason to request them into Westchester for a land "rescue" call. Everyone is so quick to say "call NYC" but it takes quite a few administrative approvals to get them authorized to leave the city. Just because the victim is in the woods wouldn't qualify. Budgets are tight all over and the NYPD isn't going to routinely come out of the city except as part of their air-sea-rescue mission. I hope this answers some of the questions.

I'm guessing Thornwood because the EMS and fire districts follow all the same lines.

Very little of the park is actually in Pleasantville's district. The entrance and perhaps part of the parking lot is but the majority of the woods is Hawthorne and Thornwood.

[sigh/] This is one of the things that drives me crazy(er). The whole park is in the Town of Mount Pleasant. None if it is in the Village of Pleasantville. Yet there are three different fire districts, three different EMS districts, and two police departments covering it (Mt Pleasant PD routinely responds to calls there with the County PD who have primary jurisdiction - dizzy yet?). Anyway, getting back to this incident. Nobody asked for aviation to respond or we would have (a crew was not on duty or they would have responded automatically). I suspect that nobody expected it to take as long as it did to find the victim or we would have been requested. On the subject of gators/ATV's - who's ATV's/gators were used in this incident?

LA has just about everything else. It wouldn't surprise me in the least!!!

Nope, you're not seeing double double! LAPD and San Diego PD land aboard the USS Midway. Now they're carrier qualified.

There are of course some Aviation Units that you're better off not criticizing... Since they might be called upon to respond in all kinds of weather they do train in all kinds of weather. Photos courtesy of Glenn Grossman, LAPD.

I think the emotional "we're all on the same team" stuff is nice and we should practice that day to day so we operate efficiently together but it doesn't excuse us from the law or from meeting training standards or making sound decisions based on our knowledge, skills, and experience. Being objective and looking at this strictly from a legal perspective, the driver of the ambulance was wrong. Had this been a police officer blocking the path of the suspect vehicle he probably would have been wrong too so don't think I'm picking on the EMS guy. I say the cop would probably have been wrong because he has different knowledge, skills, and experience upon which to base such a decision. He knows what the offender is being chased for, he knows what the law says about roadblocks (in court this will probably be described as a "roadblock" and there are, at least in NYS, pretty specific criteria when you are legally authorized to establish a roadblock). Without having the training in pursuit tactics and driving and knowledge of the situation at hand, he should have just let the pursuit go by. Did he know if there were officers down the road with spike strips? Did he know whether or not the use of force (placing a 10,000 pound ambulance in front of a fleeing car can be considered the use of force) was authorized or justified? Did he know if the decision to continue/discontinue the pursuit was being weighed given the conditions? What if the crash resulted in the injury or death of someone? What if it was an armed suspect and he shot the ambulance driver? What if one of the pursuing officers crashed as a result of the sudden "roadblock"? What if (think of NJ now) the suspect stole the ambulance to continue his flight? What if the suspect simply drove around the ambulance and became more reckless in his efforts to escape? Yes these are a lot of "what if" questions but the simple fact is that this guy was lucky the situation wasn't worse, vehicle driving faster, more desperate suspect, etc. These are all things that the court will have to consider because while you may or may not like the VA State Police, the law is the law as their spokesperson said in the video clip. The driver and his boss played the what if game too talking about traffic and pedestrians down the road who may or may not have been at risk. As for all the banter about cops running into burning buildings, I guess it depends on the totality of the circumstances. Are there situations where a cop can make a difference without undue risk, probably. Are there times where it is just plain stupid, definitely. If a firefighter knowingly runs into a hostage situation he should promptly be delivered to the psych ER for evaluation. What can he possibly do to end a hostage situation?

Just wondering who, in your experience, is the best cell phone provider in our area. Consider service coverage and service costs in your answer.

While it does seem to be a good idea to know where you could get such assistance and have a pre-plan for it, this is definitely one that will get dusty on the shelf. From the limited information in the "article" on the call it would seem that calling for the heavy rescue earlier would have been a better call since they got the victim(s) out in less than 10 minutes after arrival. I'd love to hear what the thought process was and gain an understanding of the damage involved (to both the vehicles and the victims) to learn why they thought field amputation. I wouldn't think of that right off the bat.

Depends on the aircraft. Some aircraft are left and some are right. No real signficance although some will tell you that opposite the pilot makes more sense from a weight and balance perspective.

For the tactical types...

Didn't have access to photos when I posted originally... Special thanks to Sheldon Cohen of Bell Helicopter for these photos.

Rockland's program is OK but it is not nearly as active as you may think. They're severely limited by a variety of factors and they can't stay proficient without flying so it's a catch-22. Don't get me wrong, I am friends with most of their pilots and have the utmost respect for them, but a County like Rockland has the money to do better.

One more point about your questions - in NYS there are only seven full-time law enforcement aviation units so Westchester really isn't that far "behind". State Police (from five different bases) NYPD NYC DEP PD Suffolk County Nassau County Onondaga County Westchester County A couple of other places work with private entities and use aircraft to some degree (fixed wing and/or helicopter) but that's it in NYS.