helicopper

Apparatus or other major municipal purchases are generally part of a capital project program and planned replacement schedules are not unusual. Given the call volume in Yonkers and the wear and tear on the vehicles, how can you question their plan to replace vehicles? Finally, are you really going to bring up door modifications of a firehouse? That's really a nonstarter as many firehouses have had additions or major construction due to changes in apparatus size over the years. Considering that Station 9 was built in 1932 and they still operate out of it, modifications are probably long overdue.

Others have already made great points in response to this so I just want to add one more... Capital project funds (bonds) and operating budget funds (tax levy) aren't the same thing and can't be interchanged. You can't bond for salaries (I'm pretty sure that's illegal!) and most places can't/don't buy major resources (such as apparatus) out of the operating funds (I suppose that's not illegal or otherwise prohibited, it just isn't cost effective or judicious). Yonkers is going to need these trucks regardless of the current economic crisis and having top notch, state of the art equipment will probably help soften the blow of having fewer guys to do the work.

Is staffing of 10 the normal mutual aid complement?

Facts about the Taylor Law: http://goer.state.ny.us/GOER_Information/Taylor_Law.cfm

There are legal obligations for procurement by a political subdivision or with public funds and that generally requires the acceptance of the lowest bid of the qualified bids received. The purchase of apparatus and/or equipment is generally not exempt from these requirements so specifying a single manufacturer may not be appropriate (as cited in the article). My question is why is a 10 person cab necessary - not for Tarrytown but for any FD? Most departments respond with 4-5 at most don't they? NFPA standards are for an officer plus four, right? Why double that especially in a small district where there aren't long response times or transport distances? This is municipal oversight and entirely appropriate especially in these days. There are entirely too many examples of political subdivisions not following purchasing guidelines - just go to the AG website and see all the reports where such problems are described.

A person quoted in the article works as a consultant and operates in a department that has Crimson rigs. There is no relationship between the consultancy and Crimson. While it is true that you get what you pay for, it is also true that there are economical but quality options in any purchase. Spending more money is not always a guarantee of quality.

I'm not picking sides - I am only asking a question. I say again, this is only a question! Why the need for an engine that holds 10 firefighters? When, if ever, does an engine need to carry so many?

A lawyer and a domestic violence counselor, right?

This is the BEST reason for being in a parade!!!

Wait a second, there are demerits for sobriety? That's interesting but how does anyone stay in line after complying with that rule!

A portion of that 28K did go to the LRFC, exactly how much wasn't published on the Stamford website. But the exact amount is immaterial. The point is that this family paid a sizable amount of money in taxes and expected to receive basic services in return. Unless negigence is a generally accepted basic service, I think this family was short-changed. Meanwhile, city dwellers paying 1/10th that amount in downtown Stamford receive a standard response 24/7/365 without all this drama and the emotional and ego-driven decisions to cancel responding apparatus. The concept of engendered reliance also comes into play here. Fire departments have certainly cultivated an environment where the public relies upon them and to fail to provide the service(s) expected creates additional liability.

Wow! I find it absolutely amazing that there can be a comprehensive set of rules for judging a parade in Westchester County and people actually compete to comply with them yet when it comes to the firematic side of things we have no standads for training, staffing, dispatch, response, mutual aid, operations, or accountability. Aren't we focusing on the wrong side of things? Shouldn't we adopt a set of rules for fireground operations and have judges come to scenes to make sure we're doing it by the book? Mind-boggling!

There were mixed feelings about it and abuses notwithstanding, the number and quality of IA's suffered because people just dumped info into the shoutbox instead of starting an IA. We'll see what happens, you know nothing is forever (except taxes)!

The amount of taxes paid was not a generalization for Stamford, it was for the victims of this particular fire specifically. They paid 28K expecting to receive basic services including fire protection and they were let down by the very people sworn to protect them. To me that is an egregrious breach of the public trust. You're right, people do need to get involved but as long as the public is misled by those in authority who misrepresent their capabilities or thwart efforts to have real systems because of egos and attitudes we're going to continue to have these problems. These problems in Stamford predate the current economic crisis so that isn't a valid excuse. The good examples have been around for a long time, in some cases just as long as our fractured/dysfunctional services but we have done little to change. Yes, times are tough and we have to be a cost-effective as possible. So tell me, how are 5-6 FD's in one City or 59 FD's in Westchester County cost effective? We have broken dysfunctional systems and people just keep going hoping for the best. It's absurd! The time is right to really fix things. People just need to step up to the plate and be willing to make hard decisions. And we in the emergency services have to embrace the changes in name of progress and not resist them simply because they're changes.

That's neither friendly or a constructive suggestion. People should move because their fire department(s) are dysfunctional? People have a legitimate expectation that they will receive competent and timely service for the taxes they pay. In this case, the homeowners pay $27,800+ dollars a year to Stamford. It is not unreasonable for them to expect basic services for that amount of money. They sadly didn't receive them and your solution is that they should move? Come on. Instead of the taxpayers moving out, how about the elected, appointed, and ad hoc officials in Stamford get their collective acts together and solve the problem. Fix it once and for all so that when the next fire call comes in you don't get this poor response. Taxpayers in the City of Stamford should get a standard response from the police or fire department regardless of where they live. It's in the City of Stamford, it should be the same and not predicated on outdated fire districts who are essentially their own "kingdoms". By the way, that's only derogatory if they act that way. There are plenty of examples of good combination FDs in the United States and Stamford really doesn't need to reinvent the wheel. They just need to stop putting their own interests and egos ahead of those they're allegedly sworn to protect.

How about we first settle the difference in training requirements for volunteer and career firefighters? This has been beaten to death and since I don't have a horse in this race, I'll try to sum it up with this: until these disparities in staffing/training/accountability are resolved, we'll never be able to bridge this divide. I also think that they have thought about calling in volunteers and consciously decided not to because they don't know what they'll get. Two minutes? As the crow flies or once the apparatus is staffed or what? People can manipulate these arguments in a variety of ways to suit them but there is no way to get an unstaffed apparatus on the road and to a scene in another jurisdiction in two minutes. Getting back to the case here in Stamford, two legal terms leap to mind: RECKLESS and NEGLIGENT. Either or both can sustain legal action and that is pretty damning audio to support the case. Thank goodness nobody was hurt or killed in this incident.

Are any of these proposed plans available for public review?

I wasn't aware that FEMA would reimburse local USAR teams for the personnel salaries incurred when they respond outside of their jurisdiction. I was under the impression that FEMA only reimburses the US&R Task Forces that are trained and equipped by FEMA. FEMA USAR Teams FEMA will reimburse local communities for expenses during certain federally declared disasters. This doesn't mean that when you have a local "disaster" the feds are footing the bill! There are many variables that determine when/if there will be any reimbursement however when there is a declaration, payroll costs and equipment/supplies usually can be included and that is not limited to USAR.

Want to talk about crazy population densities? The City of Mount Vernon has 68,381 people jammed into 2.7 square miles (the city is 4.4 square miles but according to census data 1.7 of that is water and I've never seen any houseboats ) But I digress. There is no valid reason for a 1.1 square mile village to have a million dollar+ EOC. If they're confronted with a major emergency they'll be receiving mutual aid from outside the village, the County will help them and they have a state-of-the-art EOC, and why would you put the EOC within the "disaster" area? No matter where you put the EOC in a 1.1 square mile village, it's going to be too close to the scene. Entirely too political and poorly thought out. I can think of much better ways to allocate 1.1 million federal dollars in NYS!

Considering all the other FD's that don't comply with OSHA and/or PESH and meet NFPA requirements I guess that's not an overwhelming critera for consideration.

Attached is the resource list reflecting the units assigned to this fire and for covers/related assignments. It's a LONG list! SALAMANCA.pdf

I'm confused. How do four guys cover two ALS ambulances and anything else? Even with one guy on each apparatus, they need two for the ambulances, and that adds up to more than four.

Tasers fall into the category of less-lethal options (as in less lethal than a firearm). Nobody should ever say that they are harmless.

http://www.emtbravo.net/index.php?showtopic=36830&pid=209958&st=0entry209958 Just wondering what other EMS providers here think. What mechanism/circumstances would make you treat a GSW to the foot (possibly from a ricochet) ALS? What would you do to treat a similiar patient who is alert and oriented without other complaint?

It's a high price to pay for fleeing the police not for being chased. Had they stopped for the initial officer they may have received a ticket, or if they were guilty of something else faced charges for that. Fleeing put them and the officers at risk but it was THEIR conscious decision and they should be held accountable for their actions.