helicopper

Don't even think about it! :angry:

This is an overly simple assessment of the problem. YES, the membership and the officers (not just the chief's) have a responsibility to provide for training but the budget is controlled by the village board. It seems that a past chief did try to fight for funding for training but the village sought to have him ousted. Another big problem is that the chief changes every two years so there is no consistency and no development of a rapport with the village board, a board that may change every few years as well. Jon Politis used to describe this problem in EMS; he called it long-term problems and short-term leaders. Everybody is going to have different priorities and with no vision and long-range planning/budgeting it is very difficult to truly effect change.

Date: 01-20-11 Time: 0215 Location: 94 St. Andrew's Place, cross streets Riverdale Avenue and Gray Place Frequency: YFD, YPD Units Operating: YFD Engines 304, 303, 306, 307, 308, 309, 310, 312, 313. Ladders 74, 71, 72, 73, 75. Rescue 1, Battalions 1 and 2, Safety, Cars 2 and 5. YPD 3rd Precinct, Empress EMS, Con Ed, DPW (for salt). Yonkers OEM and Red Cross at shelter for evacuees located at 3rd Pct Community Center. Relocations to cover stations, recalls of off-duty FF underway. Weather Conditions: cold Description Of Incident: Upon arrival heavy volume of fire on top two floors of vacant 100x75 five story multiple dwelling. Exposure problems - two similar attached structures. 0245 - Car 2 reports fire floors 2 through 5 and through the roof. 0315 - Exterior ops only, partial collapse of roof and danger of further collapses. Three ladders operating master streams IFO (2 T/L, 1 ladder), multiple 2.5 handlines IRO. Reporters: HFD23, FDNY 10-75, helicopper Writer: helicopper

Herein lies one of the problems - define "still working to secure the scene"? Does that mean the cops are searching a building and your victim is outside or vice versa? What if the victim is in front of 123 Main Street and the cops are searching 139 Main Street? Is that scene secure? What if there is a crowd gathered - do you respond or not? Odds are the crowd won't go away until the victim is removed so it's a catch-22. As for recovering weapons, if a weapon is on the ground it isn't a threat to anyone and if PD is there, I'd say that scene is pretty safe. We will probably never come to a consensus on this and it is a thorny issue for sure. Every agency needs to develop training and standard procedures for this and interact regularly with law enforcement so we are on common terms with what we all expect, how we communicate, how we'll protect our EMS asse(t)s while operating at a critical incident etc. The mantra "scene safety" is great but it really doesn't do it or the process justice.

The overwhelming majority of elected officials - excluding obviously the President and VP - have no regularly assigned, full-time security details. While this may seem counter-intuitive, prior to last week it had not posed a major problem.

Please don't mistake the levity in this thread to be apathy toward those in the emergency services, especially Yonkers, who have been demoted or laid off. Purely some good natured jokes between friends.

I'm going to hold you to this - and the coffee has to be fresh!!!

Good point - don't you love it when you're being told to expedite and the patient is still on the 3rd floor of the house and nobody on the four person crew has even gone for the stair chair yet?

I agree wholeheartedly that the village board (in this case) has an absolute responsibility here but so do the department heads - whether full-time career, or part-time volunteer. If training has been inadequate for as many years as it seems to be in this situation, the department heads are equally culpable.

Perhaps in the fire service higher education doesn't benefit you on the street but in law enforcement and EMS it certainly does. It affords you a better insight into the job you're doing and people you're interacting with - at fires interaction with people is limited, you're battling an entirely different animal. It's another level of experience and does help "round out the person". I agree with those who say a degree shouldn't be the sole determining factor in evaluating a candidate but if you can take someone with street experience and a degree, isn't that a benefit? Likewise, selection of a candidate shouldn't be solely a popularity contest. There should be some minimum requirements for any person who will lead a department (large or small, paid or volunteer). I've watched people struggle through a budget hearing because they were out of their element and who suffers when the CEO falls down on the job? EVERYONE! Instead of making a compelling argument, interacting with people effectively, and using facts to promote their position this person got defensive, emotional and fell back on the "we're the _______ service, you should do this for us argument. Hardly swayed the voters in the room or the elected officials to whom they were lobbying. You can't become an entry level police officer without two years of college today, why isn't there the same requirement for the CEO of the department (police, fire, or EMS)?

Come on Guy, tell the trruth. 1600 of those calls were little old ladies with diff breathing on Pondfield Road and half the rest were relocations for the Rescue.

WIth this in mind (emphasis mine), how many systems (outside NYC) actually contact medical control for the cessation of resuscitation efforts and a field pronouncement these days?

So, in a perfect Stamford, there would be one combination FD with a single, qualified chief and officers would be both career and volunteer who have all received (and documented) training and experience approrpriate to their positions. Has this been proposed anywhere officially?

Doesn't seem like this a bad idea. Maybe they're catching on.

Gotta agree with you, FD. There are entirely too many variables that may influence the situation so I wouldn't jeopardize my safety - or the safety of my peers - to attempt compressions during a defibrillation. On this point though, how do we address stairs and small elevators and other situations where it is near impossible to effectively perform compressions during patient movement? These situations take a whole lot more time than a shock.

http://www.firefight...y/newsid/126293 Given this recent incident in LA, I sure hope they were worried about the contents of that tank. Attached is the report on the injured FD captain in LA. LAFDBlueSheet.pdf

Just because it will take too long to go through the 1100 posts over 28 pages to find out if this has been asked and answered... Is there any principal in this debate (City Officials, SFRD, Union, Volunteer FDs, Taxpayers) who is against a single consolidated, combination department?

How does a volunteer FD owe it's chief, president, and volunteers a huge amount of money?

I don't think there are many FD's in Westchester, or the Hudson Valley for that matter, who have the depth "on the bench" of spare and reserve apparatus like Yonkers. It would be nice to see more departments properly staff their rigs during a storm like this one since response times are going to be longer but that's an entirely different topic.

I guess if you ask the same question often enough odds are you'll eventually get the answer you want...

The sad reality is nothing is off-limits anymore. Not PD, FD, teachers, public works, nothing. We'll all argue that parks and other social programs are less important than us but there are an equal number of people saying the same things about us so it's a real no-win situation. The bottom line is we all have to market ourselves more now than ever and be as proactive and positive as we can.

And coming in at # 4 this year is EMTBravo forum moderator....

WIthout comment on the rest of this debate, the one thing I will say is in this case the Union isn't looking to "save jobs", it's looking to save lives. These lives are their members and the constitutents they're protecting.

EVOC for all civilian drivers?

It's a pity they can't just teach common sense instead.