16fire5

I do expect more. I was at Arlington a couple weeks ago where I stop at everytime I'm in DC (It keeps you in perspective) and there were plenty of people there and people were respecting where they were including me trying to teach my youngins why they needed to keep their voice down. It seems to me that memorial is attempting to be so PC and progresive that they are missing the point of what they are. It make me sick and it's probably why I haven't been there.

Big loss for us. I wish him and the YFD good luck.

I have quickly reviewed the NIOSH report and I see a number of issues. Having previously read the Baltimore County report and the ATF report on the fire I believe NIOSH missed the mark on this. I disagree with a number of their conclusions related to the fire behavior and ventilation. The recent reasearch about fire dynamics and fire behavior directly disproves a number of their assumptions. Attack from the rear (Side C) At this fire the idiot occupant left the doors open to allow the cat to exit. The fire located in the rear kitchen of the apartment was given ventilation from the open rear sliding glass door and the open apartment door and open front door. A flow path developed with air feed from the rear and heat and products of combustion exited the front door. This situation probably made it impossible for the hoseline crew entering from the front door (side A) to decend stairs and extinguish the fire. The convective heat was beyond survivable and the hoseline was unable to hit the seat of the fire and thus had no chance of dimisishing the heat coming at them. The application of water from the rear easily knocked down the fire probably before the guys even stepped in the door. Small diameter hoselines do not push the fire. The temperatures everywhere after water is applied to the seat of the fire go down. Put water on the fire even through a window. Ventilation Reduces the chances of flashover and/or backdraft Much of the documented reasearch by UL and NIST in multiple venues proves the opposite is true. It appears frequently that many times our ventilation is the catalyst for flashover. I will review the report soon in much more depth but I was disappointed with this one. I still think the reports are very useful to us since they narative can paint a picture of the fire and events that lead up to firefighter deaths on the fireground. I believe the ATF did an excellent job showing how controlling the flow path could have potentially prevented this.

Reporting = Report there to work? Posting = Rig gets posted there? Thanks

Typo? Why would it be unfortunate to staff the rig with two. One is dangerous and inadequete, two is better but still half of what is optimal.

I have often complained about this orginazation mostly because they really fail to work as part of the system. They basically do as they please and seem to get away with everything they do. BUT it is hard to see what they did wrong here. They were dispatched to a legitimate emergency. They like a lot of other volunteer corps are equipping personal vehicles to meet the required standard which allows them to respond with red lights and sirens. Maybe this is past frustration coming through or we have only part of the story. Personally I feel for the cop put in a bad situation here.

I think it is going to be a VHF system due to the distances they are dealing with there.

Are there no Assistant Chiefs? How does it work now the Chief is on duty 24/7/365 and never goes on vacation? Sounds a little blown out of proportion. I'm sure the Career Chief will cover the day shifts when volunteer chiefs would be at work. If it is that bad now hopefully the new guy can pull the place together so the department doesn't fall apart if he's gone. Relax I don't think this is the case but that is how some of you are making it sound. Good luck to the new chief whoever it ends up being sounds like he or she will need it.

This is a really great way to start. Morph you equipment checks into small training sessions. When ever we had the portable ladders out for washing and they get pretty dirty on the side of the rig or in the well we would throw them against the side of the building. First it builds compentency and second it is a great way to find defects. The only way they will be proficient in tying a halyard is if they do it. Take all your ladders out and extend them against the building and mark with tape how far you can get. Take a picture. This way members know the limitations visually of the various lengths. Same goes for the saws. It's easy to get pallets for members to train with. Same goes for some rebar to practice vertical and horizontal cuts with the forcible entry saw. Air Bags. Lift someones (Chief) car or the rig. Use the responses to do training too. When investigating gas leaks I give the meters to young guys and walk them through the meters. Realize before you know it you may be one of the old guys and the young guy wil be a Lieutenant. Set him up to suceed better than you. If you see something interesting gather the rest of the crew so they see it. Whenever I encounters an elevator door out of the ordinary I encouraged everyone to get the door open (after we removed the occupants) The other thing is maybe some operational changes are possible that make people run through the motions on routine responses that will increase member compentency. This is especially important if you are a less active department. Here are some examples of what I mean. Lay in for every reported fire. Consider stretching a dry line to the door to the occupancy. Have someone do a 360 on automatic alarms, gas leaks, and CO calls. Teach them what they are looking for. Make sure the basement always gets a look. It's never easy being a new company officer just as much on the career side. Your number one job is to keep them safe. Making them as well trained and proficient as possible is a huge way to acheive this.

Why do we have trunked systems and narrow banding? Because we don't have enough bandwidth i.e. frequencies for all the uses out there. So when we suffer the consequences = busy sounds when we push to talk, unintelligible transmissions we must remember we are at least part of the problem. Take Orange County for example look at the number of UHF frequencies licensed to all the individual departments. Could you imagine if the channels were efficiently used? Just like all the little fiefdoms have duplicate apparatus so it goes with radio communications. I think if you step back and look at LMR communications in emergency services there is such a push and policy that doesn’t make practical sense. Many of it led by an unbelievable amount of federal dollars invested in emergency communications post 9/11 and radio vendors who specify complex systems. Some may think that I sound like a dinosaur who is fighting change and technology but I will give a few examples here that make no sense. The migration up the spectrum The fire service is basically abandoning the low band and VHF. Basic knowledge of the science of radio waves shows that these frequencies are vastly superior over long distances especially flat ones. Why abandon this spectrum? Even vendors have stopped making equipment. Rural areas of this country that fit this description would be best served using their limited funding continuing to buy inexpensive radios in this band. Low band is not being narrow banded by the way. Leaving UHF for the fireground. Test after independent test show that UHF simplex analog communications are the best way to go for fireground tactical communications. Digital is not there yet, and I say yet acknowledging the progress that the radio vendors have made and the belief that in my life time that it will be reliable enough for fireground use. I won't even touch interoperability here and some of the misguidedness in those efforts. As for Westchester I would be weary especially if the current UHF system does not provided adequate coverage. Without the addition of additional towers 800 MHZ would probably have even more gaps.

It is worth discussing. Since they now have tower ladders on both sides of them maybe a 75 foot single rear axle quint would better serve their tight streets. Remember most fires are residential and most (85%) of civilian fire fatalities are in residential buildings. Maybe the smaller aerial might better suit their bread and butter fires and the towers could come in behind them for the larger and commercial structures. I think a 75' aerial (especially one where the waterway pins back) would be more versitale for the bread an butter private dwelling fire. Maybe they already had the discussion.

Good to hear they are not reducing.

Do we know for sure the new position has to be Civil Service? It seems many times that these positions end up being at will-meaning that they serve at the pleasure of the City Manager or Council. Plus if they have to write it into the charter they will probably write it to favor them. It sounds like they already have canidates which makes me wonder how they advertised the job.

He probably didn't have his eyes fixated on the speedometer so that was his approximation. Either way SP Investigators are experts in determining speeds based on the crash data. I too wonder about the poliferation of SUVs in LE. I thought the new Dodge Chargers were a great idea for the troopers and other LE because of stability and performance. Disclaimer I have no LE experience and my observations are based on my thoughts and a bunch of anecdotal evidence from some experienced cops I have talked to.

Was everybody in the same class? Sounds like a lot with the facilities at Westchester. And a lot of instructors it would take to do a class of over 100.

While I think the whole requirement for membership in the company to serve in the department is outdated B.S. I think it is great he found a way within the confines of existing law to find a solution. Good Luck.

I think if you looked at FDNY houses this is the rule rather than the exception. Many time you will hear them referred to as "their buff" in reality this is usually a physically or mentally handicapped individual who is a fire house fixture. Every house I've been assigned to has one or more. Some are more famous than others e.g. Engine 64. I learned not to feel sorry for them and see they could have an enjoyable life in spite of what life dealt them. It shows why this is the best job in the world--the people you work with.

Last time I bought a live Christmass Tree I bought it from a volunteer fire department. With my purchase they gave me a sheet of paper and the paper stated was filled with all out lies and half truths. The paper stated the orginization relied completely on donations (Actually the orginization recieves tax dollars to rent their firehouse to the district). The paper also stated the orginization relied on donations to operate and failed to mention that all apparatus, equipment, and training was provided through tax money. This is not an isolated situation I have seen this in two other departments. Please spare me the entitlement complex "I get up at 3 AM so I deserve free beer and a trip to Lake George" that should have disappeared the moment that LOSAP was passed. I have stated before there are plenty of well run non career departments but probably not many in NYS. I won't call them volunteer because they are paid on call and municipally run without the interference of a social orginization.

I don't know much about Irvington Fire Department but I don't know how you could have the knowledge of the Westchester Department's to make such a statement. Add that to the fact that there are 4 fully career departments and more than that mostly career departments who train everyday. No offense but it irks me when people make statements like this that they have no factual evidence to base it off.

That is not the case everywhere in NYS there are plenty of companies that have requirements for meeting attendance (where nothing to do with firefighting is discussed) and fundraisers have attendance requirements in many cases more than training requirements. Even parade requirements so do not be fooled volunteers who are good firefighters are dropped or quit because they want to be firefighters not beer money beggars. What is also insane is members gain LOSAP credit for meeting attendance and fundraising. When we have the opportunity to examine how volunteer department's are run outside of New York it is interesting how effective they can be. I think this member did not quit in vain he is drawing attention to the archaic system that still exists here.

That's because firefighters put out fires. Trucks definatly don't Engines help.

You may not be working in the busiest company or the busiest neighboorhood but you need to be ready. If you are stressed and having trouble at routine fires imagine how things will go when confronted by the situation they were. Train. Take every run seriously, Get dressed. Be ready.

Unfortunatly this is no longer a safe assumption. Tests done by UL show that contemporary dimensional lumber fails much earlier than the old dimensional stuff. An new 2X10 fails faster then an old 2X8 (I know the the old one is really 2X8). It has more to do with how lumber is harvested today(old growth vs. new growth). When the structure was built is a big size up factor. Although we love to complain about balloon construction it really dosen't have close to the collapse potential early in the inciden compared to the modern stuff out there. Of course you need to be aware it travels vertically and horizontally unimpeded. If you haven't done so go to UL's site and go through the self guided training programs. Some are dry material but it is essential stuff that could save your life. http://www.ul.com/gl...ses/structural/

I always enjoy the insight that Barry gives on this topic. I think a lot of people are missing the point when he refers to failing and open book tests. ISO tells you what they are asking for and many communites have the equipment and manpower to be rated lower than they actually are. It's fair to guess that most of those ISO 9s could achieve a lower rating with some minimal work. If you have done your homework you can show how you are saving everyone some money.

Like it or not perception matters. In the current climate every expense is scrutinized. If the public sees the computer open to facebook thats what they think it's used for. Computers are invaluable in the command vehicle. Let's not let them think these things are toys or a perk of the job. For the record I am not on Facebook and don't plan to be I'm totally out on the look at me generation.