Bnechis

OMG, I did not know anyone had pics. Thats great Thanks. Yes NRFD is far classier than most. What Marc failed to show was the fancy lamps with the doilies under them. Back in the day Linens & Things did a TV commercial at station #2. The premises was the stations was Blah looking and while out on a run, the Lt. came back with bundles of stuff from L&T and "fixed up" the place. The Pics are from when we got back and found what he had done. My line was "how eclectic". 3 of us got paid for participating and every member of the house got a free set of red sheets with there name on the pillow.

The wording is very critical to the answer. The law does not talk confirmed or even potential. 1910.134(g)(4) Procedures for interior structural firefighting. In addition to the requirements set forth under paragraph (g)(3), in interior structural fires, the employer shall ensure that: 1910.134(g)(4)(i) At least two employees enter the IDLH atmosphere and remain in visual or voice contact with one another at all times; 1910.134(g)(4)(ii) At least two employees are located outside the IDLH atmosphere; and 1910.134(g)(4)(iii) All employees engaged in interior structural firefighting use SCBAs. Note 1 to paragraph (g): One of the two individuals located outside the IDLH atmosphere may be assigned to an additional role, such as incident commander in charge of the emergency or safety officer, so long as this individual is able to perform assistance or rescue activities without jeopardizing the safety or health of any firefighter working at the incident. Note 2 to paragraph (g): Nothing in this section is meant to preclude firefighters from performing emergency rescue activities before an entire team has assembled.

Just like the fire in Mrs. Jomes Kitchen, ISO does not care about parades. They expect a response with a minimum of 2 engines (not including engines for water supply in non hydranted areas) and either a truck or service comany (rescue) basrd on the size of the building. And most important they require 36 volunteer firefighters and 1 IC or 12 career firefghters and 1 IC (In combo dept each career ff gets credit for 3 volunteer slots). This has been the MINIMUM standard for 107 years, If your dept. cant manage to do this its time to do something about it. By summer 2011 they will be changing this standard. To meet NFPA 1710 & 1720 they are going to add 4 additional career (2 for SAR & 2 for FAST) as a minimum (which if there formula holds true means 12 additional volunteers are needed). They also in response to both 1720 and OSHA 2in 2out will require that any depts that normally respond with fewer than 6 members will automatically become an ISO 9 (10 is no fire protection).

Nope, never seen it. But if we do it should look like this: 30u1

Thats a good way to go in a small dept. (particularly those that rely on preconnected lines) but most larger depts find that unworkable. 1st we color code the butts so the hose gets back on the correct rigs. 2nd we tent to strech off the back from a non pre-connected load and break where we need it. This gives greater operational flexability. We may have 600' + feet of hose in a bed, but only strech 200', break it & charge it, then pull 350' pop a nozzle on it and work that. since no one knows where the break will be we cant color them differently. i know a number of smaller depts that buy color coated hose for the same purpose and that works well in a small dept. We require too much hose to dedicate it in that fashion. We also need to rotate it and color coating it would limit that.

According to the transcripts of the fire advisory board, when they discused setting up the trunked system, the majority of the reps felt that depts did not need MDT's so they advised the county not to waste there time developing the bandwigth.

1st, the grants wont cover that, but more importantly why do the communities that provide proper service have to cover those that do not? Either by covering or funding. Either step up to the plate or forfit the game and get another team.

The problem with not being credentialed is in many cases how would an IC know what he's getting? For example the XYZ FD announces its new Radio Tower Rescue Team along with a pic of its fancy new rig (repainted roll up Pepsi truck). The 123 Fire District recieves a call for an injured tower worker 180 feet up the tower. Upon arrival the chief sees a worker dangling at the 150 level and remembers that XYZ claims they can do this. The chief knows his dept. cant so he calls for XYZ. Can ZYX really handle this or did they take OFPC basic Rescue and they once watched a video of a Rescue? The requesting agency does not have the expertise to vet a special unit.

I did not go to Balt. It is possible. On a trip to Pierce in 2008 I saw a 4,000gpm refinery pumper that also had it and it did kind of help. Also this is not a new concept. Salsbury was doinging it on pump panels 20= years ago and its standard on european pumps

All of you are correct that the pump operator must know his pump like the back of his hand. Now how many actually do? I hear from instructoors at WCFTC that at every live burn they question the pump operator to determine what pressures and flows they will deliver and they claim that the majority of the time the answer is "I pump till the hose is hard" or a "preset PSI (i.e 125) is what we use", regardless of line size, length, type of nozzle, etc. I think that many "pump operators" do not know there job to the levels they should and maybe improved pump pannel designs might be useful for those that are not as good. This is a little more complicated panel (industrial foam unit), I dont know if it helps or hurts. BTW this is not a decal, its a permanent imprint on the panel

Look at the scene support trailer thread, it was just discused there.

The mass decon units (MDU) and the mass decon support units (MDSU) are not the same as the Scene support trailers (SST). MDU's are trailers that contain mass decon equipment MDSU's are former para transit busses used to move the MDU's or personnel. SSt's.......dont have a clue. Maybe they are just decoy units to keep everyone busy guessing.

What a great idea. The state provided 3 Mass Decon Unit trailers and the county purchased 2 additional ones. The idea was to place them out in the FD's: 1) VFD's in the Town of Greenburgh 2) Sound Shore Chiefs (Port Cheester) 3) Armonk 4) Briarcliff/Millwood (purchased by BMFD with grant funds) 5) Katona/Bedford 6) Cortlandt The career depts recieved 6 more advanced trailers because they completed higher training. The plan and training were designed to give Westchester the ability to respond to and handle a major decon event or multiple ones. #1 was turned down, now #2 was returned and redeployed to Empress & #5 was returned. It appears that the Fire Service in Westchester does not want to be able to protect its citizens. I just hope we never really need it.

Thats gone back and forth a couple of times. Technically the law allows us to go direct, but we go thru the County for better coordination.

Depends on which item. For the per capita figures I just went to each depts. budget as posted on either the fire dist website or the assessors website. The compared it to the census data. The insurance figures are based on ISO data and my own work, that I charge communities for or are part of work product that’s the property of Pace University's Michaelian Institute (I perform research there on fire service economics, and delivery models)

You are correct at 200 calls per year you can't justify career, but you also can't justify multiple fire stations, 3 engines, ladders, rescues, special teams, etc. And when you take out the automatic alarms and the minor calls you end up with 1 or 2 working fires per year, which is not enough to gain experience so as to be efficient and effective. Now whats interesting is other states and even other countries manage to cover these areas better than we do. Some with volunteers, some career and some combo. And they pay less in taxes, because they spread the burden out over a larger tax base. But this is not the case in Westchester. You are correct its economics, so tell me how do regional depts throughout the country manage to do it for less than here, with better responses, and with better insurance ratings, which saves the community 2 x 4 times what it costs to provide better fire protection? Last year I did a little research into what different depts spent on a per capita basis in Westchester and was very surprised to fine that the taxpayers in my city pay less per capita than those in about 1/2 the volunteer communities (and I stopped looking when I got to 1/2), and that includes paying for hydrants (and 30-40% less in insurance). How about this Yonkers with better staffing than NR spends less per capita and FDNY spends even less.

Since the majority of the "taxpayers" who vote in Fire District elections, the ones who approve the standard are the ones who would be required to meet them. Very difficult to force standards on someone that you want their vote. So if a similar size district, has no training, cant get on the road, etc. thats the standard they need to meet. After speaking last month with both fire service lawyers and a NYS Judge, they made it clear that in court the standard they look at is NFPA and thats what you will be judged against. If that were true, why did the State Comptroller develop new laws to protect the taxpayer, by training the commissioners. This was after audits determined that most districts were in violation of state financial regs.

1) While many career personnel live outside the cities, many still relly on career depts to protect their homes. Lets try not to lump us all together. 2) So you never go to work, volunteers never leave the community unprotected or under protected? If this protection was so good, why do we see so many IA's with 5-10 depts needed and here so many tone outs for a simple room and content fire? 3)If the protection is so good, how come the insurance industry says the more than 50% scored less than 20% on an open book test? And a very high percentage of the remainder scored below 60%? Maybe if you didnt have tunnel vission you would recognize that 55% of the residence in Westchester are protected by career or primary career depts. And if you add in the combo depts that respond with fewer than 6 career (making them primary volunteer under NFPA 1720) and there records show that the volunteer response is less than 3 interior ff's brings the % to 60. Minimal resources, Which are those: The primary career depts in Westchester own 50 engines, 29 ladders and 8 rescues to protect 55% of the population and the remaining depts own another 150 engines. 45 ladders and 29 rescues. 87 rigs protect 55% and 224 rigs protect 45% Or lack of personnel, but above you said you were protecting the burbs, so its not that, which is it? I am not anti-volunteer, as I know of a few fine VFD's and many dedicated volunteers but I believe that if you want to prove a point you need to use FACTS and not just your beliefs.

N.E. Uniform in Danbury usually has a large stock

On interfacility transfers the orders almost always come from the sending MD. "Back in the day" we did this all the time.

I have one from Westchester County, but they stopped updating it 20 years ago. Infact the one I had was outdated the day they printed it. with the number of agencies and rigs, its almost impossible to maintain. particularly when agencies dont want any one else to know what they carry or that there capability is on paper only.

The regulation normally does not require that, but the dept. that is doing the entry/running the permit program is well within there rights to mandate it. And you are correct, its a good idea.

So sorry that you feel that my safety question is such a downer. Dont worry, I will not invite you to one.

Nope, just making sure I was not missing anything. And your report card says: "works and plays well with others"

Kudos to Rye DPW......(why FD?)