Bnechis

YES it is!

Based on this logic, we can just send the chief or PD to check and advise. If we wait until there is a smoke condition or reported fire the truck will never make the front of the building.

The other vehicle was a marked FD chiefs car, also traveling with lights & siren. What probably convinced the jury is just before the accident he got on the radio and "harrassed" the other chief for driving too slow. . Posted speed is 30 mph

It would not be so hard if the neighbors had the same minimum standards for response time, training, officers, manning, etc. Until there is standardization, its less to do with liking one neighbor more than another, but if you can not get 2-3 well trained interior firefighters and an experienced officer out the door without toning out multiple times or waiting for a recall of off duty firefighters, than the IC is better off getting another dept. from farther away. Also, everyone seams to think that mutual aid will resolve all the staffing problems. Mutual aid, reguardless of how good they are is 2nd rate. ISO credits them at 90% of their home town rating when they come to help and its because they know that with different SOP's, tactics, tools and standards, they never perform as well out of town as they do in town. Westchester can get 30 Engines, 15 trucks, 5 rescues and 30 chiefs to a major incident, but they will not perform as a single unit like any major FD can.

Since they are the only game in town, they will not get more business, you go there or you go without. Since Home Depot does not fill propane, if you want your tanks filled you again have no options. there is nothing to shop for. they have a cage with a propane fill in the middle of a paved lot. They give good service, that is very different than giving you a discount because you are a "PUBLIC SERVANT".

Agreed, since fire trucks do not put out fire.... are those 1 man engines, 2, 3 ,4 ,5? Currently in Westchester most are running with 1, 2 or 3 including the officer.

If you reduce the number of people performing a service, then you are reducing the service. If going from a 3 person crew down to a 2 person crew has zero affect, then you have been paying an extra 50% for nothing. Now anyone who understads the difference that extra set of hands provideds, knows that on scene times will increase, total call times will increase, which means units will be unavailable for longer periods. You will also see an increase in injuries to responders.

The fill station is on the 2/3 corner, just drive around back. Read JFlynn's post on discounts in for emergency services in Does FDNY ride Metro North for free: #47 http://www.emtbravo.net/index.php/topic/45975-does-fdny-ride-metro-north-for-free/page__st__40

North of and south of. Since I said only 1 dept. currently is capable that means 57 other departments (in Westchester) are not. And I know of plenty of other counties & 2 other states in the region that are plaged by this. If you think I am picking on your dept. (not that I know which one it is) can you go back to the 1st post and honestly say you can do what he is asking? That would be a good project for every department. Your tone sounds like you think I am picking on one department or a group of departments. This includes career, combo and volunteers. Includes; City depts. Village Depts and Fire Districts.

Thanks for the clarification, my point was their were 11 frequencies listed to dispatch 10 agencies. OPS 5 was not even on the list. NYC to the same type of incident manages it with far fewer frequencies. Are we that busy that we can not work on fewer? T

Within hours of this thread: Location: Westchester County Aiport - Main Terminal (Rye Brook) Description Of Incident: Suspicious package Frequency: 46.26 (Dispatch), Fire 15, Fire 19, Fire 16, EMS 15, EMS 16, 155.310 (WCPD), 46.06 (PCFD), 155.895 (HPD/EMS), 155.625 (PCPD/EMS), ATC 11 different frequencies to respond and standby for what became a non-major incident. How many would be needed if we had a major emergency?

Great Topic, Thanks Dinosaur. You have hit the nailon the head. Emergency Response in Westchester has cultivated a recipe for failure. Only 1 can do it. Many can not even get 4 "interior" on the road in the first three minutes? We can not imagine that, infact we do not want to imagine that. How many FF's in Westchester (and other counties around NYC) wear FDNY T-shirts, go to presentations from FDNY members, listen to FDNY on the scanner, but when it comes down to it we want out own little fiffedom and will fight to prevent having any real ability to handle major incidents. There will always be major calls that will require that level of manpower. It just does not happen often. We generally do not believe in proper staging.....Whats the chance something unexpected can occur at a fire or other major emergency? Based on the response capabilities, we can barely put a 4 man FAST team onscene, In this case you may need multiple teams. When this happens, we will have multiple LODD's and another study...but this time it will be from NIOSH showing the country what went wrong. All of this needs to be resolved now, I fear that most will wait until the collapse. We will get at least that to the LODD Funeral, but not the fire. Not enough trained members per unit or per response. Minimal training, if any More training the range is from none, to very qualified If there are SOP's, there has to also be dispatch authority and that does not exist. Good luck. Thanks for pointing this out. Well said.

Maybe before you guess, you should learn more about a situation, because when you ASSume....we all know what happens. Our DPW looked into this system and had a demo unit for about 3 months. The concept was rejected by the city council when it was determined that 1) the manufacture of the system strongly recommended to only use it on streets without parking (this eliminates about 80% of our city). 2) Assuming that we did not have curbside parking, the city would have to replace approximatly 14 trucks and provide about 30,000 special garbage cans. 3) one of the manufacturers recommended that it not be used in communities with overhead wires ( I know others its not an issue). Its a great concept, but it looks like it needs to be done in "new" communities, maybe this is why you rarely see it in older cities.

They have had ESU for at least 30 years. They provided the "jaws of life" on all the parkways, long before most FD's in the county had them.

We do this because Albany past a law saying we have to. The state accesses all employeers based on the number of employees (and I believe amount paid) and gives that money to the MTA. It is a line item in our budget.

So some people think PO's should get a free ride, some think FD &/or EMS should. Their are pro's & cons to each. Now here is the irony; When MTA gives free rides, they are loosing money and yes they may be gaining safety/security. Now because MTA can not manage to balance its books, we have the MTA payroll tax. That means that on the New Haven Line in Westchester the Mt. Vernon PD & FD, Pelham PD & FD, Pelham Manor PD & FD, New Rochelle PD & FD, Larchmont PD & FD, Town of Mamaroneck PD & FD, Village of Mamaroneck PD, Harrison PD & FD, Rye PD & FD and Porchester PD all pay Metro North and provide the primary safety & security. Now add all the other police and fire (career/combo) depts. in the counties covered by MTA are also paying them. Now in the City of New Rochelle's case we are paying about $250,000/year to MTA. For that money we get to respond to all there EMS calls, the jambed elevators (over 100/year), the brush fires, etc. Our police are asked to cover till MTA PD can respond (no knock on MTA PD, they have a huge area to cover) and our DPW gets to plow the railroad access. Most of MTA's safety and security is provided by the local PD, FD & EMS and we get to pay them for the honor.

It would put them out as well. The majority of their production goes to other companies.

So your work boots, jeans, long sleeves and gloves have all been tested for flame resistance and labelled to meet the NFPA standard for wildland firefighting protective clothing (NFPA 1977) ? All NFPA standards are minimum standards and they require 3rd party independent testing and labeling to prove they meet the standard. Great Point.

There is no Harrison Ave in New Rochelle.

Correct on both counts. There have been 2 cases that I am aware of (one was safer, the other was an equipment grant). In one case, I know that a manufacturer went bankrupt and closed shop (taking AFG money with it), they were very surprised when days later the FBI raided the shop and the company owners homes and seized truckloads of documents. The other case the dept had to give back SAFER money and the consultant that wrote the grant and was advising them was questioned by the feds, I do not know what came of this.

And that looks like it was just the gasoline tank failing, Could have been a lot worst if it was the LPG tanks.

SAFER grants are for hiring personnel and R&R programs. It is illegal to purchase apparatus with it.

NFPA reviewed it and came up with a crash rating for brakets instead. OSHA follows NFPA and does not make its own rulings. When working on the spec for an engine in 2008 we debated this issue at length. There are a couple of issues here. 1) The type of brackets must meet the crash ratings AND be firefighter friendly, straps are not. 2) Rear facing SCBA seats w/ forward nonSCBA seats (often fold up). Due to space, this arraingment is common and the members prefer to ride facing forward. We found it common that a forward facing member would often switch mid route to the call to get there pack. Solution - we tried the west cost 5 man seating (3 forward facing SCBA seats, no rear facing seats). We found some brands at the time (ALF & Spartan were very comfortable that way), but Pierce won the bid and their cab was not good for it. One comment on the forward only seats that we heard from the West coast, was they like it particularly when they have long responses, including statewide mobilization. 3) Once the brackets are determined, enforcing the seatbelt rules is critical (and #2 covers some of that). 4) Another problem that a couple of major depts. told us was a high number injuries from slips, trips, falls and twisted ankles when mounting and dismounting apparatus. They felt that the weight of the airpack, particularly when the member is stooped down as they start to dismount, can throw the member off balance and increase the chance of a fall. Removing the pack from the cab does remove this issue. We determined that the raise roof (eliminates stooping) and additional handrails would limit this situation.

The regulation is NFPA 1001 and it basically says all equipment (and personnel) in the cab shall be secured and remain secured in a crash. The old style SCBA clips (without the strap) no longer meets the standard and more importantly are very dangerious in a crash. I remember a national fire mag. cover pic about 25 years ago of a rig involved in a t-bone accident. Their was an airpack infront of the headlights hanging from 1 strap that was caught on something on the dash infront of the officer. The discription said that that pack was in a forward facing jump seat. This means it flew 10-12 feet before passing the officers head, then continued thru the windshield (which was lying on the front bumper) if the strap did not snag something it would have made it to the ground infront of the rig. It would have killed the officer if it had hit him/her. We had rigs with the strap arraingment and found they are useless. Members hate using them as they get tangled in the straps & seat belt and prevent smooth deployment. Often they would not be used or even disabled. Starting in 2008 we debated what to do and found that there are SCBA seats that have mechanical locks that are easy to use and do not creat any problems. They can be retrofitted into older apparatus. Most important they prevent the unit from becoming a missle and harming our members.

Ok so its April 1st and anyone hired from this day forward is screwed. However if you are elected, not hired, you may benefit. I just heard on the radio that the new legislation has a hidden clause that increases the pension for the Assembly members, Senators and the Gov. and while new employees who do not work till 63 years of age lose 6/5% per year, the new pension for elected officals has them vested after 1 year. Of course this was all past in the middle of the night.