Bnechis

On the same note are full time photographers losing their jobs to volunteers? I dont think so. The Jernal news has the same number as they have always had. I think thats a litle bit of a myth. I know that most VFD's in westchester are having problems with manning (particularly weekdays) How many of these depts in the last 10 years have gone paid or even added paid staff? Out of 58 depts 4 have no vol, 12 are combo and 42 are vol. the 1st 4 and the last 42 have not changed at all and the 12 combo all I can think of is EFD has added a few positions (but they technically no longer have any vol.) and LFD added a chief. On a different note: the Journal news called the NRFD member in question here, and begged him for his photos.

Sure, Seth said that its not right for someone to be doing photography for free when there are career photographers. I just wanted clarrification if he really believes that concept. A lot of anti volunteer people have used this line (and I dont believe he is). And I am not trying to make this a vol vs. career thing.

Seth it sounds like you are against people doing something for free when others do the same thing as a career. Based on this statement, how can you not defend the argument that SOME career FF's make that volunteers hurt careeer jobs?

My wife was stopped at a red light (about 10 yrs ago) and was struck by another car. The ins. co said she was 30% at fault because she got out of bed and left the house. You're right it does not make sense. Your Insurance carrier will see it differently. They dont like paying. They believe its there money and will make you pay in the long run. This is one of the reasons that most people avoid reporting anything to them.

You are partially correct. No Fault means it was an "accident"...he didnt mean to hit your car and everyone pays partially. His insurance and your insurance will decide who is is at fault and by how much. Generally he hit you so he is 60 - 80% responsable. You are responsible for the remainder.....Your Ins company will say its 20, - 40% your fault becaus if you stayed in bed your car would not have been in a place to get hit. Tough concept, but its mostly based on you getting covered when you get hit by someone who has no insurance. The tagged part is your rates will go up to pay your %.

1) As mentioned, your insurance will go up by $1,000's 2) Maybe in rural areas, but lets think about this, in urban/suburban areas like most of Westchester most depts. cover less than 5 sq. miles. That means its about 3 miles from corner to corner. At 30 mph its a 6 minute run, now some members are most likely closer. National standards for career depts requires that other than the 1st due you need to be there in 8 minutes. So even unmanned you can do that. 3) If response time is so important.....have staffed stations. Many of the VAC's have had duty crews for 30 years why cant fire? Agreed, I'm for Blue on Official Dept Vehicles, once it is legal to do so.

Should anyone with a blue light or a helmet be allowed thru? What happened to accountability? I've seen sceens (while working EMS) where 5 or 6 depts. had members on sceen, but no mutual aid was requested. Looked like they put there gear on and just decided "I'm needed and want to play". After 9/11 to even get into the area you had to show NYPD & then MP's at seperate road blocks that you should even be in the area, and that was a mile away. At one point they changed the passes and the MP's would not allow the FDNY Commissioner to pass, in his city official car. Granted this was a bigger event than most will ever see.

"I Know Nothing....I See Nothing" HOGAN!!!!!!!!!!!

Lets not forget 211 South 4th. The former fire house turned EMS dump, turned to Mayor Davis's planned Rap Hall of Fame.

The biggest problem I've seen is the young members putting $1,000's into a light show on a car that barely runs, then doing mach 9 to get to automatic alarms. How many accidents have they caused Because the law says: 15 NYCRR 44.4 N.Y. Comp. Codes R. & Regs. tit. 15, § 44.4 (h) Except as provided in paragraph (a)(1) of this section, a blue or green light may not be affixed to a vehicle which is entitled to have red lights affixed and one or more red lights are so affixed. (a) (1) says police vehicles. 15 NYCRR 44.4 N.Y. Comp. Codes R. & Regs. tit. 15, § 44.4 (k)(6) Such light must consist of a lamp with a blue or green lens and not an uncolored lens with a blue or green bulb, except that a roof-mounted dome unit which does not include a lens, must consist of a blue or green dome and not an uncolored dome with a blue or green bulb.

The real issue is how can a fire administrator allow the dept. to violate the law. If joe citizen drives into the back of a stopped fire truck with a blue light flashing the lawers are going to say its the FD's fault, since they broke the law.

Or Sta. 11...but that one is well hidden

I'll give you that. they are way ahead on CAFS, but they need to be due to interface issues. They can also afford it since they mostly have regional serices. If we got rid of 1/2 the rigs we could pay the $40-50 K for this.

Also helps when you understand the economics of fire protection. Most of the property is owned by Disney which is self insured. But self insurance requires you follow loss tables and the lower the risks (due to great codes) the less $$$ needs to be set asside for insurance. I've written the same violations over and over for our home depot. It got so bad at one point we were sending them to corp. The violations are present most times when I walk in. I wish they were as good in this region as you have in yours

I hear from many instructors that when overseeing live burns they ask MPO's what presure they pump at and the common answer is 125psi. When asked why, the answer is because thats what we always pump. I agree, the MPO needs to know what he is doing, the question is does he? The majority of apparatus comittee members have no busniess being such. I looked at 2 recent deliveries (1 that was featured in a fire mag, talking about how wonderful it was). I tried to get up to the hosebed (units inside, clean & dry with great lighting) and I could not safely do it. & I was not in turnouts, on the side of the road at night in the rain. My 1st thought was they built a climbing wall. Can you back up your beliefs? USFA Fire Fatalities per million: Tx - 10.7 NY - 10.3 Fl - 10 Ct - 9.7 NJ - 8.4 CA - 7.1 Looks like this is almost equal. NY better than Tx, CT & NJ better than Fl. The one thing I see being way way ahead is FL & CA both run much more regional departments and they believe in onduty minimum manning far and away more than the NE. Where in Europe do they have a limited water supply? I've ridden in Hamburg, Bramen & Hanover (GER), Paris, London, Perth & Edinburgh (both in Scotland). Also went to Morton-on-Marsh The Fire Collage of GB. and I thought they generally had better water supply systems. In Paris, for example they have below grade hydrant conections (hydrants are carried on pumps) every 100' on bothe side of the street alternating so every 50' your have a hydrant. Was amazed to see a pump pull up and only use 15m (45 feet) of hose everytime to get water. Never heard that water run-off was a failure, did hear that having a fire was considered a failure (on the part of the occupant). They generally use less water because they do not build using combustible material. most buildings are stone or concrete. They use indirect attack more...thus the steam.

Its not the apparatus that keeps the low losses. Reedy Creek Improvement Disrtict has the best fire & building code in North America, All strucutures, including temporary, sheds, etc. are fully sprinklers. They have a very agressive fire inspection program (including daily inspection of public assemblies...most places due it annually). They have proven that aggressive codes and code enforcement can almost eliminate fire loss.

HFD & EFD were in SFD's Crossway Firehouse 3 blocks from the scene, training. They were on-scene in under 1 min from the time of the explosion. NR & WP were not in Scarsdale, so they were not closer

And what is so bad about tradition? You imply its only in the northeast. Have you ever seen how it operates anwhere else? Its interestiing to see how advanced the fire service is in Europe. They are atleast a decade ahead of us, and have been that far ahead for the last 20+ years. They have just as much tradition and ego, but it does not slow them down. They also dont use CAFS except in the interface Interesting that outside of Interface areas, the places that are buying CAFS have almost no structure fires. USFA did a study in Boston on CAFS to see how effective it was in a NE urban setting. They said it was useful, but not enough so to justify paying for it. NFPA can mandate it, but do you think that will make Boston, NY, Phili, Baltimore, DC, Chcago, Detroit, etc. buy it?

Wrong order. If you cut the trench 1st how do you know where to cut it may already be past you and if not the trench will draw the fire, then you will lose the trench and the rest of the building. Vent hole 1st. This will draw the fire towards the hole. Its ok to procede to the next step if the roof has self vented. 2nd inspection holes to determine where to cut the trench. use either a plung cut or a small triangle (3 plunges of the blade) just enough to see if you have fire, hvy or light smoke. 3rd cut the trench. (this building, with this understaffed crew will never finish in time).

Agreed. The problem with being overwhelmed is what has chased a few 2 1/2" lines out of the halls during wind driven fires. This is a concern that has killed a number of FDNY members over the past few years. If a direct attack does not push "fire" then why do we teach that good tactics dictate venting infront (so the fire can be pushed)?

Very true...the east stopped allowing roofing with a "D" flame spread and the west still allows old technology (combustible shingles) that has risked hundreds of lives and cost how much property loss? When was the last time we had a major confligration on the east coast? Baltimore 100 years ago? I'm not saying the east or west is better or worst...but I had to go after this line

Care to explain this? You can push fire from outside, but if you are inside it can't be pushed?

"How to put it out"? Tell congress to stop subsidizing it. It is not Environmentally friendly....they use patrolium based furtilzers and coal to process. it uses more energy than it makes. It's caused price increases in corn, & wheat....raising the price of food. We need alternative energy...but this is not it.

Agreed.... "make them increase staffing".........good luck.....HOW? I know of no VFD's that have been able to do it and very few career depts. And the combo depts. claim they dont need to because they have volunteers, but if none are showing up, they are just under manned depts. "Mutual aid" - look at what is being called to most minor fire's its like a whose who of dept's. MA is suppose to be for the "big one" not for every one line fire. I think the main reason that most ff's in Westchester are not fighting for manning is they are afraid that they will bring in career ff's or will disband and merge their social club.

The problem is right now most FD's in Westchester need to call 8 depts to handle a bedroom fire. Your stripping 15% to 20% of the county of fire protection before you even start rehab. FD's need to start taking a strong look at what they are capable of doing and get their heads out of the sand (was going to say head out of ..........) Most FD's have SOP's that do not allow any injuries until after the 2nd alarm is placed....LOL