Bnechis

That's what almost everyone does. But its not the dealer who pays. In almost every case the contract is between the municipality and the manufacturer. The dealer advises the manufacture as to the costs and they get reimbursed from the manufacture after you pay for the truck.

If you have a budget you must stay within, the money man is just a waste, unless he will nitpick every item, then he is a major detriment. I have sat on committee's for career, combo and volunteer depts. and if you have a target amount and/or a max amount you are set. Many committees I have witnessed have no clue what the process is and spend time on everything but what is important...i.e we don't care how much water actually flows through it (as long as the plaque says xxx more than some other dept). But we spent 20 hours debating if the blue light should be on the left and the red on the right or the other way around. (and it takes 5 minutes to change the lens so what difference does it make) The other big mistake I see is "we want it exactly the same as the unit its replacing but 30 years newer" ...... Does that rig perform the way it needs to? "No, but we still want the new one to be the same". In 30 years have you ever used the front suction with the shiny cap on it? "No but we want it on the new rig so they look the same".

The trip is not free. Depending on the location of the factory (Airfare, hotel meals, etc.) The costs for flying to mid west for example add approx. $1,000 per person per trip and that is built into the cost of the truck. The "Dealer does not pay" he fronts the money and you pay as part of the cost of the truck. So 10 members going on pre-construction, pre-paint and final to Pierce or Seagrave or Ferrara, Smeal, Spartan etc. will cost $30,000 that your tax payers will cover. Also with that size group, their are almost always more "add-ons"..."Hey look at the spinny light that mildew hose has on their new pumper, we need that too" I have been told by manufacturers that they can easily see $50K - $100K in increase because of it. We send the spec writer and the mechanic. Unless its driving distance, then we might add a chief.

A few months? wow, must be an extra big check

I agree. The problem is it only affects Fire Districts that run an ambulance and want to bill. So the number drop way down. Every year it is on the legislative agenda for FASNY, NYSFCA, NYSPFFA & the Fire Districts Association (NYSFDA). The problem I am told is that the legislature tells most lobbying groups (and that includes these) "what are your top 3?" Then most part ways. (NYSPFF - Pensions, disability, etc.) (FASNY - No training mandates, blue lights, benefits, etc.) and so on. Silver can suppress it because the only people who vote for him live in lower Manhattan and its no issue to them. But it is an issue to a number of his contributors, who do not want competition for FD's.

I will try to look for it. It is in federal law tied to CMS (Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services). I had a copy of it a number of years ago.

And a court ruling that parts were unconstitutional

This has been a legislative "priority" for at least 25 years. It has been proposed in EVERY legislative session over this time and Speaker Silver has never let it out of committee, and as long as it does not make it to the floor it will never be voted on. Also every year I have heard people making a big deal of..."Here is the legislation we need".....but clearly most are not aware that this has been going on

If you do the cost analysis on apparatus, a few well planned fleet management plans show that in the long run the best financials is selling before its 10th birthday. You get the most resale and least maintenance costs. Plus more reliable and safer fleet. Too many places think you save money by trying to stretch the rig till its ready for the scrape yard. They can call it what ever you want, but that's not enough water to be a tanker.

I don't think so. Its federal law

Northampton = 11 letters, Westchester = 11 And I saw a Beeline bus Yesterday with Westchester on it.

Any billing "soft" or "Hard" is illegal in a fire district based EMS in NYS. "Soft" billing, while commonly done, particularly by many VAC's is illegal under Medicare/Medicaid rules

Ok lets throw a big monkey wrench into this: NYS just got rid of ambulance plates and official plates. The new plates will list the agency by name: FDNY, Transcare, NY-OEM, Parks, Sanitation, Westchester Dept. of Emergency Services, etc. They are now out there and as everyone renews they will get the new plates

Because you can stretch hose but you can not stretch ladders. When working as a flycar medic covering a number of different communities I watched depts. that never understood the value of this. Was amazed when the chiefs would order the ladder to stay away from the building so the engines could stretch in. At one fire, after the above happened, it was determined that the aerial was needed, so 1,800 feet of charged 5" hose was manually dragged out of the way so the ladder that was ordered away could make the front of the building.

They were dead in my eyes when they closed the New Rochelle one 20 years ago. The manager their claim at the time it was one of the best grossing ones in the chain.

The problem is each engines 5th man costs about $650,000 to cover 24/7/365 and they spent $2,000 on each gadget.

Some people in Rochester...like 1%? They fought very hard and spent millions to drop the quint/midi and go back. While the quint/midi might work well in some places. in Rochester it was clearly designed to cut staffing: 1) Double Companies (engine & ladder) with 3/1 on each (total 6 firefighters & 2 officers) 2) Quint/Midi Co with 5/1 on quint & 1/1 on midi (total 6 firefighters & 2 officers) 3) City Manager: "why do you need 6 on those ladders, we use to have 4" 4) Quint/Midi Co with 3/1 on quint & 1/1 on midi (total 4 firefighters & 2 officers) The big problem is does the quint "fit" the community? Many are too big to operate in some communities Cost: 3 midi / 1 quint = $2m+ (not equipped) 3 engines / 1 ladder = $2.5m+(not equipped) Plus maintenance and future costs may be a little lower with the midi/quint's But switching the fleet at one time to make this work is very expensive. Unless you need to replace the entire fleet.

We have been working with our neighbors and I believe that they will also be on board in the near future When we 1st set it up we used the FDNY 7 digit code (as we had not developed our own). At one of the FDNY/Westchester Drills our EFAS Board & FDNY's were set up side by side and the FDNY guys were very confused because they kept seeing FDNY Engine 22 and Ladder 12 radios at the drill, but those FDNY rigs were still in Manhattan and to far to transmit to EFAS. A few days after the drill we figured out it was NRFD Engine 22 and Ladder 12 radios in the FDNY board. We also receive all FDNY Maydays on EFAS Since then we came up with a numbering system that will work for all Westchester FD's and not mimic FDNYs #'s

Interesting view. So lets see how an FD functions in a democratic society: Chief of Dept gets 1 vote and he wants all new engines to be painted pink with orange and purple poke-a-dots Union has 11,000 votes and wants red engines. In most cases the chief will win this vote, unless the union has the political clout to get the chief fired. If the brass wants it, they get it and in many cases they do not ask the rank and file.

Thanks. I am very familiar with EFAS as New Rochelle FD also has it. And while SDI (the company that developed it, not the Navel Research Lab which they work for) developed EFAS, the EBF4 (electronic ride list) and the RFID system which is still in the testing phase with about a dozen FDNY companies. Our work with them has been a little different. We have EFAS, but the EBF4 was designed to work for FDNY and by design would be too costly to modify for any other dept. So with SDI, NRFD helped them develop EasyStaff which is a cloud based electronic riding list that is easy to customize, is designed to work with any size department from single station to multiple battalions and multiple divisions. Since it is cloud based we can make changes to the riding list from any device with internet access. It is also simple enough that we expect that a member who comes in on an early relief can change it at the watch desk without having to wake the officer. We decided right from the start that we had no need for the RFID technology. While the riding position and radio assignment are most critical in a smaller dept. knowing the members names becomes more important. An additional component in EasyStaff is the SCBA assigned is also tracked. Thus when low air or pass alarm goes off, we also know who it is (which is similar to the pak traker function, but we get more info to the CP). With EasyStaff we can also see the members assigned in other departments when they come up in EFAS (if they have EasyStaff). Because it is a different source than the EBF4 when FDNY radio's come up on our EFAS (and our radios in FDNY EFAS) you only get the 7 digital code, which if you know the key, you know the assignment (i.e. 5005401 would be FDNY Engine 54 officer). What I have heard from both high ranking FDNY and SDI is this all came from the off duty guys joining the rig on 9/11. The concept was if you get on the rig we know you are there, even if not on the EBF4 or even if you have no radio. The biggest problem is what if you take someone else's coat? Did it solve a problem, don't know. Will it be implemented city wide, 50-50 bet on that now. Another agenda, could be, but the original intent had no other agenda. From a development standpoint, the system is very promising as the way to by-pass EasyStaff or EBF4 for volunteer FD's where members show up in POV's and at different times.

Do you adjust the electronic riding list during the tour if personnel changes are made i.e. a member has an early relief or a stand-by etc.?

Interesting Article, Guess its been long enough since the last time we went down the stupid trail. They say the fire service is a 100 years of history unspoiled by progress.... Here we are failing to learn from history. Back in the early 1990's we started with the every rig should have water....The Quint Concept. or even the Total Quint Concept. We even had the mini/maxi concept. We put everything we need on one truck and it 1) does nothing well and 2) add $100,000's to the cost of the rig. St. Louis is now backing away since it doesn't really work as advertised. A couple of large VA depts. are now at the 1st replacement round and are asking why have the fleet costs skyrocked, and maybe we should not do this. Rochester went back to traditional units, because it too found it didn't really save money or work well. Now if we cant get rigs on the road, adding another piece of equipment that somebody has to carry into a building is not going to help. This week I heard 1 dept in the county paging out for any available interior firefighters to respond to an automatic alarm. Well if you can not handle a response to an A/A then equipment is not your problem. Every department in the county has taken millions in taxpayer money with the understanding of those taxpayers that when they call the FD, they will actually show up. If you can not do that, it is time to merge with someone else, hire someone else or hire your own staff. Neat tool? do you put it on over or under your SCBA? So this backpack weights about 45 lbs. So you use them on your initial knockdown but you have to leave your SCBA on the truck. Sounds like another toy that some depts. will buy with tax payer funds and it will sit on the rig till it no longer functions and its then thrown away.

The irony is how many of them are LAWYERS

Each has only 1 FF or 1 captain. On a good day One will have a FF the other will have a FF & a Captain.

Negative. The protocol went into effect about 2 years ago after a major incident in Queens that occurred on Oct. 26 2009. In that incident a gas leak in the street followed pipes into multiple homes and built up till it was in the explosive range and found an ignition source.