Bnechis

What about any laid off members off SFRD, since the residence of the proposed district already invested in their training?

FASNY is very proud of this bill. It will prevent volunteers form getting jobs and will result in volunteers who utilize the law getting fired for there current jobs. But at least the can say they have this great new law. If your employeer is not willing to let you volunteer on his time without this law, how well do you think this law will work?

How can you possible say that it will have no economic impact when even FASNY says it will (they claim it will be minimal). Then why is it needed? So my employeer has a 50 year old policy that says if you are late by 16-30 min you lose 1 days pay plus you must pay restitution for any overtime cost to the city. THis is for a 1st offense and it goes up from there. Yes I'm sure it will not be a problem our tax payers will understand. Yes more than 30 minutes on the 1st offense and a hearing officer may determine if this is "abuse" there may be an opening in the roster. So agian I ask, Then why is it needed?

That does not work if you are not releving someone, as in positions that only work a float shift. FASNY claims it does. Good point, It is claimed that the law says an employer cant punish you, but if you abandon your position the DOH or State Ed can & will take your cert or license. If this were true then this law is not needed because all volunteers would have to show up to all calls, all the time.

Since SFRD have already been operating in the VFD's has that ment their demise or has the demise been based on the VFD's not having enough volunteers? You believe that can, but the two total structure losses dont appear to agree. How would adding career staffing have helped save the Deep Valley Trail Fire which was at 8:50 pm? What did the courts say about the way the career members where treated by the volunteers? Respect is a 2 way street. So the Taxpayers of Stamford should pay twice for testing. Why should additional testing be needed? is it because some of the volunteers either did not take the test or did not score well? We should the testing be done exclusivly for 1 department? Westchester runs 1 test for towns & villages and 14 departments use that list. Maybe the career FF's who all Stamford residence paid for there training should be also given points. Maybe they should go to the top of the list. Or not. If Local 786 loses members and the new dept career members want to unionize (and with the history why would they not want to) 786 will have them declared a rival organization and then they can only join 786. So why havent the volunteers already met and exceed the challenges they have already been face. Its great to say we will do better in the future, but they have been saying that for the last few years. So suggest that any SFRD members that are laid off are the 1st hired before yourself or any new hires. If there is enven a slim chance of layoffs in SFRD and a reduction of fire services in downtown then 786 has a legal and moral obligation to be at the table. Since 786 already represents members who work in North Stamford then they should have been at the table. The fact that they were not shows that someone has either an agenda or something to hid.

Its Briarcliff Add Eastchester, Harrison, Port Chester and I think Tarrytown & Ossining

I was a volunteer in a dept with paid drivers and they had more training than I did, but they were not allowed to go in, so they pulled up stretched a line to the front door and left it there. Then they stood at the pump panel and watched the house burn, until the volunteers showed up. That was 25+ years ago and things have changed. There are 9 combo departments in Westchester that run with 1 or 2 career fire fighters on the rigs & still have volunteers responding. The rest are mostly career with a very small number of responding volunteers. Now of those 9 department the career guys were in the past "paid drivers" but half of those departments are lucky to get 4 or 5 volunteers to arrive at a working fire and have an average of less than 3 interior certified volunteers in the whole department. This is not speculation on my part, I have seen the numbers. So the paid driver example is kind of a great historical example. These departments average 1 or 2 working fires per year. No one is getting experience there, but the career guys are still required to have 10x the training as the volunteer chiefs. Finally the "paid drivers" from 30 years back dont have any bearing on whats going on in Stamford. Now

No hysterics, just lots of questions. Nope, no problems with the volunteer fire service, the problem is when the VFS instead of managing its issues resorts to forcing others to support it. As Chris put it; this is feel good legislation that will not make a dent in the problem, but the legislators who cant pass a budget and are all scared they will get thrown out in November hope that the volunteers will forget every other issue and support them because of this feel good legislation.

So my store or business is in Yonkers or White Plains or New Rochelle or Eastchester or NYC (on fire or not)....how does them running back to there village help my business? I think those business would rather they stay at work and volunteer on there own time....not company time. How many volunteers commute to NYC or the other cities listed above and leave there communities unprotected? If this is so important, then maybe they should not commute out of the community. Now what happens if your mom's in the hospital, I hope the RN or MD is not a volunteer who now can leave the job to cover a fire call, because you would rather they show up to your store/business and put out the fire? The volunteer who works at the county jail, would rather they show up to your store/business and put out the fire or stay to protect the other DOC members and the public in general? What about the medic who work for a municipal or commercial EMS service? Sorry he could not get to work on time and missed the call, but there was a call back at the VFD or VAC and that was more important. Now we have volunteer firefighters who are employees of my career department. Does the legislation mean they can come to work late or leave work to cover calls back in their volunteer community? To cover them the citizens of my city will have to pay overtime to cover this. That means that my taxpayers (who are willing to fund proper fire protection) will be subsidizing a volunteer community that if they utilize this law (if signed) shows they are willing to let our taxpayers fund their dept. Whats amazing is that tonight Albany is ready to shut down the entire state government, but this legislation sailed right on thru....................

"as told to me" and "Last I heard" is very strong proof that your facts are all correct. So did they do 2,000 calls but 80% or 8,000 calls were given away? I don't think so or did the recieve 2,000 calls (which sounds about right for the population) and they gave away 80% or 1,600 calls. Lets assume the 1st. they did 2,000 calls and they billed $400 per call (average) the collection rate ranges from 50% - 75% so your $800,000 is closer to $400,000 - $600,000. If we assume the 2nd, then they did 400 calls and collected $200 - $300 per call or a total of $80,000 - $120,000. So whats the correct amount: a. $800,000 b. $600,000 c. $400,000 d. $120,000 e. $ 80,000 f. None of the above. The information is such a wild a** guess that there is no way to calculate it. New ambulance cost more than $100,000. And you left out insurance (liability, vehicle & workers comp) which are substantial. Because it is illegal. Because it is illegal. And if they had not broken away and started hiring EMS staff (which was clearly needed) then they would be increasing the tax levy on you.

Great legislation for volunteers. Now a prospective employeer can refuse to hire an individual who is a volunteer or fails to disclose it on an employment application. I wonder if that was considered? I wonder how fast one would be fired if because of a call they were late for there shift as a LEO, career FF, Health care worker or EMS employee? The NYS courts have often held that a labor contracts will superceed this type of policy, will be interesting to see how this plays out. Do you think the Teamsters will risk a contract for one of their members to volunteer? From FASNY's Website: "The bill, which,..... would prohibit an employer from immediately terminating the volunteer employee solely because he or she was late or missed work due to a bona fide emergency to which they were duly dispatched." We need to know what the definitions are: 1) immediately terminating - does this mean the employeer has to wait till the 2 or 3 time? 2) define a bona fide emergency? An MVA? Fire call? We need to know what the definition is. 3) define duly dispatched? If FF X was not "dispatched" by name was he/she duly dispatched?

Polish Paramedics.bmp

While it will be there right not to organized, it is highly unlikely that they will not. With the history of employee abuse that has been previously reported in regards to career firefighters working in one or more of the VFD's in Stamford I would bet they will be union represented. Now what happens if they chose to be represented by Local 786? This will most likely creat additional friction between the managment of the SCFD (thats Stamford Combination Fire Department - Lets call it what it is not what we hope the citizens will think it is). Now how can having multiple barganing units in one union cause a problem in Stamford? Generally the courts and arbitrators look at similar "units" for comparison and these 2 will be prime. So the unit in the north proves that the community can "afford" a 5% raise instead of the 3% that the south got. Next contract the south says, they are the comparison unit and they automatically get 5% and the trend continues. This can drive up the costs in the same way that Nassau & Suffolk PD go back and forth to be the highest paid PD's in the nation (different unions, but they use the comparison). What happens if the volunteer numbers stay poor and the union then claims that there members in the north are being placed in an unsafe situation compared to those in the south. The courts could again could say make the conditions the same. So you could have the tail wagging the dog. Lets say this works in the 1st few years, what happens at any point if the vollunteers continue to drop off (as is the local, regional and nation trend)? at some point you will be forced into the exact same situation you have today. Two (or actually 3) Fire Departments in Stamford is better than 6 but you are only pushing the fight from 1776 off till 1861. At some point in the future everyone will pay for not truly resolving the problem. "those who fail to learn from history are doomed to relive it"

Thanks, I did see that. I know a number of municipalities that have been billing for up to 35 years. I believe they are doing it as a municipality billing for services it provides. THe Fire Department is prohibited from billing, but not the city or village. The bill you referenced has been brought up every year for at least the last 15 years. It was gear for the fire districts which are directly prohibited. My city did the billing for its services for 26 years. We never ran an ambulance. The contractor billed the city a monthly fee and the city billed the patients. We looked into running it thru the FD as the "contractor" and the city still billing. We were advised by the comptroler that it was legal (we never ended up providing the service).

The only restrictions that I have ever seen is that fire districts (as a direct taxing authority) can not bill for services. Technically fire departments dont bill the municipality does and that is legal. I can not find any mention of billing for service in GML 209.

The problem is in good times the administration also wants us to "give a little". In past years when times were tough we were told if we worked with them, they would make it up to us..........still waiting.

My neighbors could not figure our how to call 9-1-1. Asking them to do CPR is a stretch.

Yesterday I heard 60 tone out a department: "X" with the following message: "ladder company to stand-by inquarters for dept. A". Can some one please explain why do some departments do this? If dept X's ladder is in-service then when the tones go off it should be responding (regardless to which community - X or A). If dept X's ladder is not in-service then is not available. Does this stand-by improve response times to dept A and if it does why not do it all the time, so response times are improved in Dist. X?

So the plan is for two Fire Departments. What can we learn from history? In 1776 the founding fathers could not come to agreement on the issue of slavery, so they ignored the issue. Many of them wrote that they knew this issue would never go away and all they were doing was putting it off on a future generation to resolve. It came during the civil war. "A house divided against itself cannot stand." I believe this government cannot endure, permanently, half slave and half free. I do not expect the Union to be dissolved — I do not expect the house to fall — but I do expect it will cease to be divided. It will become all one thing or all the other." - Abraham Lincoln The "plan" looks more like the easy political solution. Will it work? Will it cost more? It does not matter because it solves the mayors political issue...do something and it will take years to figure out. "Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it." - George Santayana There is one other possibility; maybe the mayor knows the voters won’t go for it and then they will roll out plan "B"

Its not unfortunate, its criminal that the state is so far behind the times on such a vital issue as firefighter safety but that is what the volunteer fire service (thru FASNY) has lobbied Albany hard for years to maintain. So since the state is unwilling to step up to the plate the volunteer leadership has to; 1st be the chief, be the leader and make it a requirement of your department. Require minimum training standards that are realistic and protect the lives and property of those you swore to protect and most importantly to protect the lives of your members. 2nd be a leader and tell FASNY that lack of training standards is hurting the volunteer fire service and they need to fight to make the standards comprable to what NFPA & ISO require as minimums.

The last proposal was the town would cover them with existing units, which means fewer cars on patrol/available for calls both in the village and the town. Most would not consider that to be an improvement. I do not know what there coverage is or would be under that and generally I prefer the economy of scale, but one always needs to consider what the level of service will become.

Brow lights are floods mounted just above the windshield. On R-4 we have 1 that is 120V Halagen and 2 Whelen Pioneer LED's. THey are flood lights, but becuase they are LED's, throw a switch and they are flashers.

Thanks We have the brow lights that can flash on Rescue 4 That error was corrected and updated to all prospective vendors about a month ago. Thanks again.

"It was a typical case of American Blind Justice and the judge wasn't going to look at the 27 8x10 color glossy photos with circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back to be used as evidence against us"

It sounds better than "rumor has it"