IzzyEng4

I hope there will be a fitting tribute for Capt. Harris on the show and also up in Dutch Harbor. RIP Capt.

Just because it is ordered in 2008 does not mean that it will be a 2008 model year for a rig. Usually when building a truck, the year make of the truck is determined by either when the chassis is built or by the completion of the truck. For example my rig at home is a 2006 Smeal rescue pumper built on a Spartan Gladiator LFD chassis and cab, which was built at the end of 2005 and states the cab is a 2005 model. The truck is classified as as a 2006 because that is when the rig was completely finished. Also the model year does not determine the life of a rig either, that is determined by the placed-in-service date. So you can have a rig ordered in 2008, finished and delivered in 2010 and place in service in 2011, so after 20 years of service its scheduled replacement would be by 2031.

KME is really moving up into the area!! Has their quality gone up? I know they had a bad rap for a long time.

This is pure snow! Do you have any idea what the street value of this mountain is?

Also reports through the local area are stating search and rescue began this morning. They fear there are still more people under the wreckage.

WAS, I did listen to New Haven C-MED and said to Derby EMS they couldn't get a bird out of Westchester County, it was unavailable, they didn't go into great detail why. Maybe they were on standby for Middletown but I can't confirm that since that area is covered by KX (Colchester) C-MED control. Also I was hearing that Boston Med Flight was on standby (both Worcester and Boston) birds for the incident in Middletown. If I hear anything more I will let you know. Also the child patient in Derby is high risk and requires to go to CCMC for his condition so ground transport from Derby to Hartford is out of the question. (I can't go into great detail do to patient confidentiality and I'm familiar with this child since I used to work for New Haven C-MED).

What department did the pumper come from in the Island?

Also during the incident, both Lifestar choppers were in the air and at the scene. Atlantic Air 1 was requested to Derby for a critical special needs child patient for transport to CCMC.

Just got back. I didn't get activated to the scene but I took a ride up to Portland directly across the CT River from the plant and had a good view of the building. I got there after the fire was placed under control. The building according to the residents there was totally enclosed, after the explosion the roof was gone and the side walls were heavily damaged. A friend of mine who lives in Haddam (the next town south from Middletown) thought her house came off her foundation it was so powerful. My sister and brother in-law live in Hamden and felt it as well as reports of hearing the explosion and feeling the "blast" as far out as New London, Colchester, Rocky Hill and East Haven. There is still a number of "unconfirmed" reports about how many people were hurt and/or missing. CT's USAR team is there as well as hundreds of firefighters through the Capital Region "Task Force" response system. Coverage on the following sites: http://www.wtnh.com, http://www.nbc30.com, http://www.FOX61.com, http://WWW.NECN.com, http://www.wfsb3.com Also to add to Sage's response list, Connecticut Valley Hospital's FD, located on top of the hill from the plant was there, Cromwell Fire, Portland Fire were on scene and also providing coverage in Middletown. Wallingford and Meriden FDs had units to the scene. Please keep in mind the families of those who were hurt in this tragedy.

Date: 2/7/10 Time: 11:22 Location: KLEEN ENGERY PLANT - River Road Frequency: 46.18 Units Operating: Confirmed Operating Departments: Middletown FD Middletown South District FD Westfield FD Durham FD Portland FD Haddam FD Colchester FD Meriden FD (Coverage) Berlin FD (MCI Unit) Hunters Ambulance American Medical Response Middletown PD CT State Police Lifestar (Both helicopters) Task force 51 (Wethersfield, Cromwell, Newington FDs) covering calls in Middletown Task force 57 (South Windsor, Glastonbury, Manchester Fire/Rescue, Manchester 8th Dist., Marlborough, and Colchester) Weather Conditions: Cold, clear Description Of Incident: Reported major explosion at Kleen Engery plant, MCI incident Listen here: http://hvfc.wesleyan.edu/msxcntyscan.asx Reporters: IzzyEng4 http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/02/07/connecticut.explosion/index.html?eref=igoogle_cnn http://www.wtnh.com/dpp/news/middlesex_cty/middletown-power-plant-explosion

Well someone did it again!! A funny dub of that crazy former WWII German dictator ranting about the new iPad: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQnT0zp8Ya4&feature=player_embedded

Just found an other article that he came out of the medically induced coma on Feb. 3rd. The stroke happened on Jan. 30th. http://www.realitytvworld.com/news/deadliest-catch-star-phil-harris-out-of-medically-induced-coma-10342.php

Its different over here in CT when it comes to political incorporation, we only have boroughs, towns and cities. As for special incorporations, we can also include special districts (ie water, sewer, fire protection, ect.) We do not have a county level of government, that was abolished years ago. In CT there are 169 incorporated towns with full municipal powers. Of this there are 8 subordinate incorporated boroughs within their respective towns or city/town consolidated, one independent city withing its town, one city administered with its town, one consolidated borough/town and 19 consolidated town/cities. Connecticut has these subdivisions plus other special service districts through its Home Rule Act. To read up more on our governmental system here is the wiki link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Administrative_divisions_of_Connecticut

I think this is the best question posed in this thread!!! When I saw this I immediately said yes without hesitation. But likewise if I had hesitated, then I shouldn't even be thinking about being on a RIT unit and should be getting more experience and training in rescue. Makes everyone think now huh?

I believe Greenwich Round Hill Company 6 and Long Ridge in Stamford are the closest to that area, however I am not sure or that familiar with the area. Both run tankers if I'm not mistaken.

Question for you, what are the differences in population size over these areas listed? Is that also a factor? Also waht is the population density per squar mile?

BFXFD, my view towards being on a fast team should be with at least five years of firefighting service before you are considered to be assigned to operate on a team. I understand that yes a person may or may not have a lot experience by then (depending on the department or amount of training). But I wasn't saying that you shouldn't be taking the courses before this period, every firefighter should be. It's like the old saying, if you want to learn how to pump an engine, you better know what happens on the nozzle end, same thing with cutting a roof, you better know how to hook a ceiling inside first. Also to the "maturity" of a firefighter five years in is also better too, the person regardless of age might have that "excited" state of mind still for the work but has grown also to think more rationally also. I should have conveyed that better in my thinking, but this is my opinion also as I have trained with a lot of different people for FAST /RIT and also took part in helping teach. NY10570 the reason I feel that FAST / RIT members should have some medical training such as basic CPR / First Aid or at least 1st responder status is because what happens if you pull a member from a building and is in cardiac arrest? Shouldn't you know how to do perform CPR?? It's an asset in case the team runs into this they are the first ones that are going to be with the rescued member during the "golden hour" so to speak. What about if there is some sort of traumatic injury, we need stabilization right? Granted the team will not be doing this in the hazardous environment, but as soon at the hurt member is out of the building, medical treatment should begin and who better to start than the people that are right there. Each scenario is different but it doesn’t hurt, remember this is RESCUE not firefighting and the FAST / RIT unit's duties don't just end by pulling the injured member out of the hazardous condition. the are the first responder for the firefighter. My comment about the firefighters for the past 300+ is to remind people that we have been doing this for a long time and now we have a new "specialized tool in the tool box" dedicated towards rescuing our own in these situations. Looking back yes hind-sight is bliss and yes we could have probably saved more firefighter lives with the implimentation of the FAST / RIT concept sooner but that shows how times have changed as well as our overall focus of the fire-ground. As for going back to buckets, sure, as long as they are only used to keep the beer and soda cold for "rehab"!! Also another consideration with FAST / RIT, out of every four or six members of this unit after it is activated the "average" is 1 team member will also be hurt while performing a rescue. Something to keep in mind also

Thank you Capt., I appreciate it for getting the right information out there for me.

Hey we can all agree and disagree with each other, sometimes it get s heated. But in the end we are all the same, passionate about what we like to do so shake hands and be gentlemen and ladies. If not, don't let the door hit your backside on the way out to the Wahhhmmmmbulnace!!!!!

I decided to do a spin off from a lot of the response questions that have been asked about in recent IAs. Lets start with the question as in the title: When should apparatus and manpower be request to respond? Every town, city, village, borough, hamlet and district is different from the rest. Some have hydrants every 500 to 1000 feet, while others require a static source with long supply lays or tanker operations to establish a water source. But where does the call originate and begin? AT THE DISPATCH CENTER! If the dispatcher's CAD has everything listed in it (FAST/RIT, to the scene units and cover companies), shouldn't the dispatcher be able to send out the appropriate response depending on the information they receive without waiting for the chief or officer saying "Send me this for this department"? In a perfect world yes, the IC has enough to worry about at the scene and shouldn't be worried about ordering apparatus and manpower but should be concentrating on what is coming as announced by the dispatcher. If there is need for additional equipment, the request should be as simple as "Send me the next alarm" or "Give men an additional engine, truck and Fast team." Now comes into the problem of where is the apparatus coming from. Could the next due tanker or truck company be coming from a mile away or 10 miles away? Is the request for a certain piece of equipment coming from a staffed or unstaffed station? Will it take time for the proper number of personnel to assemble at that station before getting the rig on the road? There are a lot of considerations when requesting units for another town / district and those need to be considered and in the back of an officer's head while responding and also on the discretion of the dispatcher. When I was a dispatcher in my former life, my partner had received a call for a working structure fire in a rural section of the town we dispatched. This department has four engines with 1000 gallon water tanks, one 3000 gallon tanker, a truck, two rescues and two mini pumpers out of two stations. Well our CAD was going through an update when this call came in with people still in the structure while on fire (not trapped as updated calls stated everyone was confirmed out). The advantage was my partner and I both knew the area well, knew there was some hydrants in the area but because the CAD was going through an update of information, the closest hydrant wasn't listed. As he dispatched out the call, I continued to check the cad for surrounding hydrants. By the time he was done, we both looked at each other and yelled "TANKERS!", so I took on getting the mutual aid tankers going, ordering one from each of the surrounding towns, placing two more on standby, ordering the RIT / FAST unit and getting the list for cover companies ready. We called out the water holes as one of the line officers stated that the closest hydrant was 3/4 of a mile away (this became our replenishing site). In this instance the operation worked, we had 9000 gallons of water on wheel s coming into the scene and the three M/A tankers were there within 5 to 10 minutes of the initial dispatch. And if we didn't get that water out on on the road well the structure could have been a total loss and only the water on scene was used (good knock down and overhaul). Where I work, we do operate under a county mutual aid system. When an alarm goes out a department sends their first alarm response as outlined in the dispatch center's CAD (they call this a Box Alarm). When a working fire is declared the response is upgrades to a "Box Plus" bringing in those necessary additional units (FAST, tankers, air supply, extra ambulance, ect.) The upgrade happens depending on either by the first arriving unit or when taking multiple calls or even from another unit outside of the fire department (ie police or EMS). Everything is there and usually there is a one pull system, the FAST team comes from one of two career departments, certain departments have towers, aerials or quints, ect. Its all listed and the county chief meet regularly to update their information and manpower with each other. Some departments can handle a single or two alarms at one fire when others like mine automatically call in mutual aid right off the bat to fill the assignment. So let's get back to the question at hand, when should a request be made for additional apparatus and manpower? Should it be right off the bat without hesitation doing the old "When in doubt, send it out" or having units "post" at their stations? Should you consider going to a second alarm upon seeing fire conditions, should you think about calling for the third alarms assignment and put them in staging? When should have cover companies com in and should they be the next up for the next alarm assignment at the original scene or should you "double up" so you have the right units "in town" so you can call some to the scene while others cover the town / district? What should you have in your dispatch center's CAD so you as an IC don't have to think where to get a certain piece of equipment upon a working fire or other emergency of great potential? Isn't better to have your M/A units on the road at the initial dispatch if they are part of the initial assignment? If you have initial manpower issues, should you consider skipping a district / department or adding a unit from next one over who has a staffed rig and can be there quickly to the initial assignment? Should you consider the "One Pull" system of apparatus and manpower response to make sure you have proper coverage? I can go on and list so many more questions but let's make this a progressive discussion and see what we can learn from this.

I want to show a great run card. This is for the City of Brookline, MA from the Mass Metro Fire site: http://www.massmetrofire.org/images/BrooklineCard.jpg If you look at it, it tells you what is needed on each alarm and where the unit is to go. The IC only has to say "strike a second alarm" to the dispatcher and not worry where to decide were to get the apparatus from. If we are going to argue about response times in this forum, here is the place to say "HEY, we need to fix this and here is how!"

Yes you are correct but when it comes down to it, when recordings are looked at on tape, they are not considered in a lot of cases unfortunately, they should be though. (I've down thousands of tape reviews and made sure the seconds were there though they were not required but they never changed the outcome). Also, though I may be wrong on this and I will stand corrected if found to be, I have never heard of ISO looking at seconds, they always considered by the minute. Like I said I maybe wrong on this. And speaking of seconds: I started a thread about when to mutual aid and additional apparatus here; http://www.emtbravo.net/index.php?showtopic=35594&pid=203180&st=0entry203180 Everyone come over and get into this. It doesn't matter if its a small town looking to another or a large department calling all hands to respond. Share you insight.

I disagree, it isn't a tough question. Your FAST / RIT unit should be staffed with people who are experienced, have at a minimum Firefighter I, Haz-Ops, taken the certified Fast / RIT course, taken some rescue classes and at least 1st responder medical status. I think a person should have at least 5 years of regular firefighting experience even before you even think of taking a RIT / FAST course or becoming part of a team. I don't care if you just put your app in as a vollie with a FF-I cert or just got your certificate from the academy, you are still green there and trying to learn too much in the first few years you are part of the department (AND junior corps and explorer posts don't count as time in my book). If you can't field a properly trained and staffed unit, then you shouldn't be in the FAST/RIT business. (Besides firefighters have been known to very capable in rescuing there own for the past 300+ years)

Date: Feb 2, 2010 Time: 20:18 Location: 91 Jewett Street (Crosses of North Spring and Vine Streets) Frequency: 156.1875 - ops, 154.0775 - fireground Units Operating: Engine 3, Engine 6, Ladder 7, Squad 9, 2-Bravo-8, 2-Bravo-9, Derby Engine 13 (RIT) Description Of Incident: Box 39 struck for reported heavy smoke in the hallway of a 2 family residential structure. Car 24 (Asst. Chief) on scene reported smoke showing. Fire was located on first floor "D" side. Incident under control in 20 minutes. Writer: IzzyEng4