lad12derff

New York City mayor Bill deBlasio ordered city workers to remove the last remaining Confederate Battle flag flying from a city office. The flag which has flown there for over 100 years was removed and placed in a brown paper bag for safekeeping.
The mayor has also mulled prohibiting sweet tea and BBQ in restaurants….Curtailing any public showing in theaters and on TV of the popular movie classic ‘Gone With The Wind.’ Public Utilities director Abraham Schwartz also proposed removing all signs on city highways that say ‘south’ in a effort to eliminate all racial references.
The controversial mayor also ordered the city police department head Bill Bratton to hire more black police officers even though their background checks show a high percentage of drug use and criminal convictions. The mayor defended his actions by saying, “Who better to have on the street beats than cops familiar with drug sales and criminal enterprises.”
Critics say Police Commissioner Bill Bratton has a long way to go to comply with Mayor de Blasio’s demands that the number of black cops in the NYPD reflects the city’s overall racial makeup.
The two Police Academy graduating classes since Bratton took office in January 2014 were just .5 percent African-American…far below the 16 percent figure for black cops currently on the force.
De Blasio on Monday announced that 1,300 more cops would be hired after months of insisting there would be no cash for more officers in this year’s city budget.
The New York Times is also reporting that New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio had a tattoo of a Confederate flag and the motto “the south shall rise again” removed from a delicate part of his lower anatomy.
See full article here

"The wisdom was 'We know you're not going to fight fires at the same time generally' so you should be available (to help your neighbors)," Davis said.
I now feel much safer going to work and knowing the chances of Mount Vernon catching a job is greater than us. So there is no way I'm going to be put in any kind of danger that tour. Thanks for clearing that up Ernie, I've been worrying all these years for nothing!!!!!

The real question that needs to be asked is this, "Is it really MUTUAL AID? The definition of MUTUAL is "reciprocal", or to make it more simple, party one helps party two when party two needs help and party two helps party one when party one needs help and it is done on a more or less equal basis. So, my question is, does anyone know how often Mount Vernon responds Mutual Aid to Yonkers compared with how often Yonkers responds Mutual Aid to Mount Vernon? And if Mount Vernon does respond Mutual Aid to Yonkers, does it do so with a similar complement of equipment and manpower? and does it do so with similar frequency?
If there is NOT reciprocity, if it is all one way with Yonkers responding to Mount Vernon but never the other way around, then perhaps Yonkers should consider terminating any agreement it has to respond into Mount Vernon.
There is a growing problem across the country of understaffed departments counting too much on mutual aid plans for coverage and then not being able to fulfill their half of mutual aid when the other department really needs mutual aid.

The real problem is not if they should consolidate, its how can MV participate equally? YFD provides excellent fire protection to its citizens, while the political climate in MV is to rely on the neighbors.
The real issue is every career and combo will call back off duty firefighters to man spare apparatus or provide additional personnel to the scene during a major emergency, EXCEPT Mt Vernon. The MV Mayor expects everyone around them to pick up that cost.

I forwarded it out also.
By the way, what is wrong with rotary phones?

I don't read it that way. The article goes out of it's way to never directly link the merger with the Sheriffs Office. Even the Sheriff himself, who arguably would be that much more powerful, gives a very lukewarm quote. That being said, I personally think it should be the Sheriffs Office. The idea of two independent, county-wide police/patrol agencies is nonsensical.

No worries. You won't hold that title for long around here!!

No worries. You won't hold that title for long around here!!

Not trying to beat a dead horse here but I wanted to give my take on why we don't take a fire truck to every alarm (no disrespect spin-the-wheel as I think your posts are very knowledgeable and well thought out). This is my opinion on the matter....
When I was a fire officer I used to cringe when the department's large pieces would leave the firehouse. The tones would drop and a chauffeur (he could be 21 years old...could be 77 years old) who would drive a truck once a week (at best...some guys would only drive once a month, or even once every three months) a mile down the road to a bullshit call would hop out of his Honda Civic after being jolted from a sound sleep during a rain storm and get behind the wheel of a 30,000lb engine with 5 other souls on board.
Now, add a mutual aid situation to the mix. This guy is driving the rig under the same situation as previously stipulated (rain, being jolted from a sound sleep in the middle of the night, and only driving once a week at most...maybe even once a month if he is an occasional chauffeur) and add the stress of responding to a working fire, on unfamiliar roadways outside of district, and in close proximity to dozens of other large pieces of equipment who also have amateur chauffeurs. The potential for disaster or damage is huge here.
When I was Captain, our rescue was parked at a parade and the bucket of a neighboring town's ladder that was backing-in next to the rig went right through the front windows of the cab. It took the rig out of service of 3 months to get fixed. Over that time my life was extremely overcomplicated because our rescue was absent, our engine was overloaded with rescue/extrication equipment wherever it would fit, operations and training were extremely overcomplicated, and the quality of service that could be provided to the taxpayers was negatively impacted. I learned a valuable lesson here...if you can handle an EMS call with a utility, then there is no reason to take an engine.
The solution to the problem is training...but as well all know manpower is sparse and if you make it too hard to get qualified then the guys would get discouraged and just give up trying. So you just have to say, "this guy has put in as much effort as I think he is willing to put into this and he knows enough to not get anyone killed on the way to your everyday alarm. He can draft and put an attack line into operation so we will have to just give him our blessing." The department with which I was previously affiliated didn't even require drivers to take EVOC or Pump Ops to Chauffeur an engine because the members simply would choose not to drive and the trucks wouldn't get out.
Do I agree with this? HELL NO...
The problem is inherent to the volunteer fire service and cannot be adequately corrected as the involved factors are correlated...you can't have all three: knowledgeable, quality chauffeurs; happy, motivated and accomplished-feeling manpower (drivers); and apparatus that make it out the door for every alarm.

Danger, on 06 Mar 2015 - 10:33 PM, said:
ok here goes, the fire service in Westchester is FINE!!!! responses are great, fire ground accountability is perfect, manpower is more than enough.
NOW THATS THE DUMBEST THING WRITTEN IN THE HISTORY OF THIS WEBSITE!!!
Sorry to take away your title lad12erff.

Glad I made history. Guess it's not dumber than parking 7 Engines on a 1 lane rd to transport manpower.

Glad I made history. Guess it's not dumber than parking 7 Engines on a 1 lane rd to transport manpower.

Glad I made history. Guess it's not dumber than parking 7 Engines on a 1 lane rd to transport manpower.

Thanks for responding quite accurately on how to implement, and I will Quote " Probably the dumbest thing I've read on this site in over ten years, impressive " the use of a bus to transport. I will now just sit back and continue to read more great ideas on this site and add my dumbness to the conversations!!!!!

I guess it is not possible to build vehicles for transporting firefighters and their equipment then?

















Thanks for the post, I never realized how many different designs for crew transport their were, I only considered a van or suburban. Now I need to go get a picture of NRFD's 2300 passenger van (that we use for transporting relief crews to fires) I cant find any pictures of it.

I guess you have never heard the old saying " so goes the first line so goes the fire "

Here is a pretty important piece of information needed for a pre plan in the winter. Piles of snow on the side of the road which most likely made this a one lane road would tell me as an IC that I don't need 31 pieces of equipment on scene. ( that's what the assignment shows in the first post ) If you had a down FF how far away was EMS? Were they blocked in or out by all the equipment? Once again it always ends up that people don't want to learn from others and they really do get their panties all in a bunch. I'm sure this was a downright snotty job and fire was everywhere and all companies made that push in as we all talk about after the fire. I know in the 20 years i'm doing this all my fires were described as down right nasty, snotty old school jobs!! Get Real, the house was lost before you arrived. We have all pulled up to a losing battle!!!!

Or training with pre plans. You can train on tanker shuttles, and I'm sure they do, but if your going to try and correct someone please don't make a fool of yourself. How about all you guys who state that manpower was needed come up with a plan on how to get the manpower there without wasting equipment needed at home. We can't outfit a small bus with 8 SCBA's to transport members of a mutual aid dept to the scene? I guess it's not as fun to respond in on a job on a bus as it is an engine!

You guys love to throw around that pre plan term but do you really know what it means. If I ask the COD of the Goldens Bridge FD for his pre plan of this house can he produce it? Please stop with BS terms you don't know nor use!

Here is a pretty important piece of information needed for a pre plan in the winter. Piles of snow on the side of the road which most likely made this a one lane road would tell me as an IC that I don't need 31 pieces of equipment on scene. ( that's what the assignment shows in the first post ) If you had a down FF how far away was EMS? Were they blocked in or out by all the equipment? Once again it always ends up that people don't want to learn from others and they really do get their panties all in a bunch. I'm sure this was a downright snotty job and fire was everywhere and all companies made that push in as we all talk about after the fire. I know in the 20 years i'm doing this all my fires were described as down right nasty, snotty old school jobs!! Get Real, the house was lost before you arrived. We have all pulled up to a losing battle!!!!

Here is a pretty important piece of information needed for a pre plan in the winter. Piles of snow on the side of the road which most likely made this a one lane road would tell me as an IC that I don't need 31 pieces of equipment on scene. ( that's what the assignment shows in the first post ) If you had a down FF how far away was EMS? Were they blocked in or out by all the equipment? Once again it always ends up that people don't want to learn from others and they really do get their panties all in a bunch. I'm sure this was a downright snotty job and fire was everywhere and all companies made that push in as we all talk about after the fire. I know in the 20 years i'm doing this all my fires were described as down right nasty, snotty old school jobs!! Get Real, the house was lost before you arrived. We have all pulled up to a losing battle!!!!

Yeah I think we're confusing "alarm assignments" with "pre-plans." Those are not the same thing.

So I have been watching this thread for a couple of days and really don't like to Monday morning QB but can someone explain to me why you would stretch not one but two 2 1/2 in hand lines into a 1800 Sq Ft residential fire? There are 2 things that are most needed to make that choice of a hand line successful. The 2 critical factors were most likely not met here. They did not have the manpower nor the water to operate these hand lines. I would think that those lines would produce about 500 GPM combined. That would certainly not be my choice as the first due Engine company officer who is counting on a tanker shuttle. A couple of 1 3/4 or 2 in lines would be the right choice to start out with as they are a lot more maneuverable in the confined qtrs. of residential fires. Leave the 2 1/2's to commercial fires and depts. that have the manpower to move them unless you are making a giant circle with one and sitting on the front lawn with it. I won't talk about the lack of exposures at the fire which would negate the need for 7 Engine companies and a tower ladder that most likely never made it up the driveway and would have better served its community by staying in qtrs. So I will end this session for all you Engine company officers out there to refresh upon. ( paid or volley )
There are several fire flow formulas in use today, but for the sake of space, we’ll only touch on two: the National Fire Academy (NFA) formula and the Iowa Rate of Flow. Each has pros and cons.
The NFA formula is based on offensive interior operations where less than 50 percent of the building is involved. The formula is:
Needed fire flow = [(length x width) ÷ 3] x percent of involvement
Example: For a 30' x 50' building that’s 25 percent involved, the flow would be 30 x 50 = 1,500 square feet, divided by 3 = 500 x 0.25 = 125 gpm.
Based on that required fire flow, one handline pumped at the correct pressure should be able to produce the required gpm.
The Iowa Rate of Flow is based on work performed by Keith Royer and Bill Nelson while they were working for Iowa State University’s fire training program. While studying the effects of fog streams on interior fires, the pair demonstrated that all you need to do is put the right amount of water in the right place for the fire to go out—something that’s often overlooked by the modern fire service.
The Iowa formula is:
Required volume = (length x width x height) ÷ 100
Example: The same 30' x 50' building used in the first example is 10 feet high. 30 x 50 x 10 = 15,000, divided by 100 = 150 gpm.
The Iowa formula is based on science, while the NFA formula is based more on information gained from experienced fire officers from around the country. The Iowa formula is also based on a 30-second application rate, which is more applicable to today’s fireground, where application rates should be based on gallons per second, not gallons per minute.

So I have been watching this thread for a couple of days and really don't like to Monday morning QB but can someone explain to me why you would stretch not one but two 2 1/2 in hand lines into a 1800 Sq Ft residential fire? There are 2 things that are most needed to make that choice of a hand line successful. The 2 critical factors were most likely not met here. They did not have the manpower nor the water to operate these hand lines. I would think that those lines would produce about 500 GPM combined. That would certainly not be my choice as the first due Engine company officer who is counting on a tanker shuttle. A couple of 1 3/4 or 2 in lines would be the right choice to start out with as they are a lot more maneuverable in the confined qtrs. of residential fires. Leave the 2 1/2's to commercial fires and depts. that have the manpower to move them unless you are making a giant circle with one and sitting on the front lawn with it. I won't talk about the lack of exposures at the fire which would negate the need for 7 Engine companies and a tower ladder that most likely never made it up the driveway and would have better served its community by staying in qtrs. So I will end this session for all you Engine company officers out there to refresh upon. ( paid or volley )
There are several fire flow formulas in use today, but for the sake of space, we’ll only touch on two: the National Fire Academy (NFA) formula and the Iowa Rate of Flow. Each has pros and cons.
The NFA formula is based on offensive interior operations where less than 50 percent of the building is involved. The formula is:
Needed fire flow = [(length x width) ÷ 3] x percent of involvement
Example: For a 30' x 50' building that’s 25 percent involved, the flow would be 30 x 50 = 1,500 square feet, divided by 3 = 500 x 0.25 = 125 gpm.
Based on that required fire flow, one handline pumped at the correct pressure should be able to produce the required gpm.
The Iowa Rate of Flow is based on work performed by Keith Royer and Bill Nelson while they were working for Iowa State University’s fire training program. While studying the effects of fog streams on interior fires, the pair demonstrated that all you need to do is put the right amount of water in the right place for the fire to go out—something that’s often overlooked by the modern fire service.
The Iowa formula is:
Required volume = (length x width x height) ÷ 100
Example: The same 30' x 50' building used in the first example is 10 feet high. 30 x 50 x 10 = 15,000, divided by 100 = 150 gpm.
The Iowa formula is based on science, while the NFA formula is based more on information gained from experienced fire officers from around the country. The Iowa formula is also based on a 30-second application rate, which is more applicable to today’s fireground, where application rates should be based on gallons per second, not gallons per minute.