Ga-Lin

Now here is another question for the agency. The suspended EMT is at the bay with another EMT & a driver when the call for the 4Y/O comes in ......Two minutes later another call comes in for an injuried 80 Y/O man. The question is why were they not already signed on & enroute to the first call. Two minutes is really a long time to be sitting around when everyone (crew wise) is there.

People, both civilians & us in the Emergency response community, get very emotional where sick or injured children are concerned. If this young man was "a loose cannon" as someone sugested and needed to be reeled in, this was not the instance to do it. True, rules are rules but you also need to, sometimes, pick your battles. This could have & should have been handled better. No matter how you look at it .. it hurt 'em & to a larger extent all others in the volunteer community. In reading this I was wondering if the young man in question would have been of the same mind if the call was for the elderly old lady who fell and couldn't get up (Fx hip) or the old man with belly pain (GI bleed or maybe just constipated) they also deserve the same level of concern on our part and unfortunately seldom get it.

No problem Bro. This is a hot topic and seems to have struck a major cord with everyone here. As a result some fingers are flying faster than they can keep up with the reading or is it the other way around/

In the article the Captain stated that the policies were not a result of being dictated by their insurance company. Reasons came down to "experience & training"

It has nothing to do with the rules, its about control of the many (mostly newer, younger members) by the few (mostly long standing, older members). This is the main reason so many VACs have staffing/membership issues. Instead of qualifing people and clearing them based on ability (this guy is a NYS EMT, already works for a busy commercial service, p/t PD. VFD) they force him out. I just wonder where the Capt and other Brd members who voted against this young man were when this call was going down? 4 page outs, I mean really! And then the so called Captain states that "this is the type of story that the public" (which he supposedly serves) "doesn't need to be told" "There's no value in this story other than shock value" (at least he got this point right) "and gossip" He also states It's about "going through the proper training" "Experience driving other ambulances doesn't necessarily matter" I'd like to know what driver training they offer in order to "properly prepare" their members. This is a guy who has been around since he was 15, restarted the youth squad of his corps, which in well run places brings in a supply of young, already well groomed members. Now he's done and probably for good, along with how many of the Jr. members who looked up to him as a role model.

The Educational Opportunity Center of Westchester will be offering a EMT course begining in Feb. Daytime program, two days a week 9-5 per day. Course and textbooks are free, no need to belong to an emergency agency only need to show a financial need, HS diploma or GED, valid Drivers Lic. with a clean record,take a screening exam (reading comprehention, basic math skills etc). For more info contact EOC admissions at (914) 606-7620, email at EOC-Admissions@sunywcc.edu or visit the EOC at 26 South B'way Yonkers, NY

Back in the day when I worked NYC the PD would ALWAYS say "Put a rush on the bus centrel" no matter what the call, either it was bad and the didn't want to watch with thier hands in thier pockets or it was utter nonsence and they didn't want to stand around with thier hands in thier pockets. Expecting us to put it in warp speed in order to get there....as if. I would , same as now, just aknowledge the message and continue as I was.

A PPD skin test is a test to see if you were exposed to TB, there is no vaccine. Depending on where you work they may or may not offer this test depending on your risk of exposure. Hep B shots must be offered by your employer but you can opt out of it & must sign a waiver.

Regular surg. masks are ineffective against the flu virus, you must wear a N95 hepa filter mask in the size that has been fit tested for you in order to offer any protection. The flu of 1918 (H1N1 strain by the way) struck down people mostly in their early to mid 20's rather than the usually more supseptable children & seniors. Est wordwide fatalities from that pandemic 75 - 100 MILLION. In 1918 we were still crossing the atlantic by boat the average crossing from Europe was 6-7 days a "fast crossing" took 5. Now we can go from NY to Japan (more than twice the distance) in 24 HOURS or less. True, the virus does morph from season to season and while the vaccine may not prevent the flu it will help in not having a severe case. As for avoiding people with the flu.. in the outbreak of 1918 whole towns tried to quarintine themselves with armed gaurds at thier borders.....it didn't help towns still became infected. My advice would be take your shots like a good boy/girl.

NYS SEMAC & SEMSCO has finally approved IN narcan for use by CFR's & EMT's. This still needs to be approved by the Commissioner of Health. Once approved protocols & educationl package will be developed & distributed. IN narcan was recently in the news being handed out to "high risk" general populace.

I would guess the ans. depends on how you view yourself, primarily. As a LEO or HCP (health care provider) As a stickly LEO I can understand the reason for pursuit & also cuffing a suspect ASAP. I've watched those real life police chases where after the suspect has a spectacular crash the officer actually risk their lives to pull him from a burning vehicle (which he stole) only to have the perp ,as soon as his feet hit the pavement, take off like a gazelle across the Serengeti with a lion in hot pursuit. As a HCP I cannot see myself pursuing anyone in my ambulance or fly car. Although I did once, more years ago than I care to admit. An old time NYPD Sgt. gently took me aside & asked what I was thinking. what was I going to do if & when I caught him. what if he had a weapon. He had seen me work on various calls prior.to this & told me "kid we all have our jobs to do & you seem to know & do yours well, let us do ours." Your point of view got me thinking about another issue to post.

You really can't go down this road, once begun where does it stop. Should we stop treating cancer patients, how about not resus anyone over 80, or how about 75. No, better as health care providers to treat everyone. Lfie is presious, some people do turn thier life completly around and become "useful members of society.

Morningjoe You edited your post before i got the time to respond. cCan you give me a hint where this "utopia" on earth is...... so I can avoid it

Couldn't your ambulance call you for "assistence'

Maybe we should follow Conn.'s lead and distribute them to the general public. Like free needles

Just spoke with one of the medics the other day. They were all downgraded in pay to EMTrate until issue is resolved. Most are starting to look elsewhere.

Anyone know the particulars of why. Not that it really matters, I agree with watercan they'll just change the name and start over or sell it off.

What the Hell is going on in Detroit ! PD commis resigns in disgrace, a few weeks ago their own PD is telling people to visit the city at their own risk because they feel they are unable to protect them. What's next, health care professionals telling people to move out because their own city is trying to kill them ! Time for the President to declare Detroit a federal disaster area and send in the troops !

Hard to belive but triage tags are not required equipment as listed in part 800. Executive order #26 signed by then Gov. G Pataki designated the "ICS as the state standard command & control system during emergency operations." Later (1998) Kits were distributed by NYS DOH EMS to VAC's, REMSCO's, Course sponser's etc. and many still have those original brown MCI kits in the bottom of the outside compartments,you know, along with the other never touched or used equipment such as vests, flares, etc. I wonder how many actually have looked in the kits, much less had a drill in their use. I just had a discussion with my EMT class on MCIs, here's what I came up with. The average capacity of a metro north car is 100, the eve commute runs about 8-10 cars. Thats 800-1000 people thats more than a plane crash. Lets just say that by the time the train reachs say Katonah in Westchester or Harriman in Orange county they have half of that capacity 400-500. Train derails. Lets say that just a third of that number are injured. The rest were lucky (real lucky) that still 125-150, lets say half of them need ambulance transport, the others are walking wounded and can be transported by bus (if your community has thought that far ahead & can mobilize) that's 62-75 bodies. Two streacher patients in each ambulance....30-40 ambulances!!! Certainly commercial services will have to be used but lets think about command & control. I've seen many VACs hold MCI drills (which I admit is less than most VACs do) and they always seem to have enough resources to deal with their pt. load, amazing. Sorry for the rant, but I think many VAC & county leadership just don't think past the day to day problem of just staffing one ambulance, and we should...thats our business & our community depends on us for it.

Since this topic originally asked about training for FF's not responsible for providing medical care for the public, lets start there. First, I believe all emergency providers, which include LEO's should be trained in CPR & the use of an AED. It's a few hours of training & the payoff in saving a life is immeasurable. An AED should be at every fire call/response, whether a trash fire or an all hands-5 alarmer like we had in Cornwall yesterday. I'm not sure if cardiac arrest is the #1 killer of FF's on the fireground but I do know its at the top. It should be immediately available as the trucks arrive and not waited for until the IC calls for an ambulance standby. As we've seen recently in MV, cardiac arrest can happen to any of us, at any time, anywhere, that's why its know as sudden death. Secondly, I would limit training to life threatening injuries only, specificity bleeding control. Other training is academic, if you're not responsible for moving someone from point A to point B, other than removing them from a unsafe area in which case care is postponed, why do it. If you are not tasked with providing such care you probably don't have the proper equipment such as splints, C-collars, KED's, backboards etc. While I agree with Barry's post, on why are we cutting up the car, I think this 1.)attitude & 2)Cervical immobilization(as opposed to cervical stabilization, applying C-collar, KED /long board) could be addressed in an extraction class. Thirdly, if the dept. is responsible for public care it also is divided into care at scene only &/or transport. If its care at scene only, CFR should be enough. As ALSFF, I also have some issues with the current curriculum, but at the moment, its all we have. It provides enough background for initial treatment of emergencies encountered when responding to care for the general public which, hopefully, FF's don't have such as asthma, OD's etc. If you're transporting, EMT level. The problem that I both have & see with requiring CFR &/or EMT is not so much the initial training (at least with CFR anyway) its the upkeep both in the actual cert. & with maintaining proficiency. Finally, I see alot of dept requiring FF's to also be either EMT's or Paramedics. My opinion is that its both a mistake & asking alot. I'm not a FF, but as a lifelong career EMS person, I can tell you I'm constantly reading, going to Conferences & keeping up with what's new in addition with being active in both the field & teaching in the classroom. I am under no illusion that firefighting is any different. With new hybrids, electric autos, hazmat & other firematic stuff there are not many who can keep up & do both well. Leadership is, either through outside civil pressure (town, district etc) or internal reasons trying to expand in order to pump up their response numbers in order to justify their budgets or prevent layoffs, attempting to make people a Jack of all trades yet they are masters of none. This is especially dangerous in a volunteer system where members are not also working FF's, EMT's or medics but regular 9-5ers. Additionally, there is, what I call the emergency providers mindset. When asked who you are or what you do, how do you answer FF, EMT, medic. That's your mindset, as you see yourself, that's where your effort will go to maintain proficiency. If asked most FF, if honest, (paid more than Volunteer I think) will resist becoming involved in providing EMS. Now here's the question, do we, as civilian members of our individual communities want someone who doesn't see themselves as or doesn't want to be providing EMS caring for us or our loved ones. In my community we have separate VFD & VAC yet there are some who are both. While this might look good when looked at by both organization individually the emergency SYSTEM, as a whole, is weak when we are essentially counting one member (& two different jobs) twice. That's my opinion.

I'm not. The mans either an idiot or a sexual predator, 6-4 you pick 'em. Personally, I'd go (as I'm sure the DA will) with sexual predator. I don't know if everyone read the report but (those of you who are sensitive can skip this part) in addition to pinching the girls nipples he states that he inserted he's right middle finger moving it up & down "I just diddled it" he says. Meanwhile it goes on to say it took about 10 min. to get to the hosp. He did the aforementioned after other procedures at tactile stimulation failed. What clinical significance justified such action. None. Now, over the years, especially back in the day, hearing about some moronic barbarians twisting nipples (on male pts) in order to elicit some kind of response. I've never, ever heard an excuse/justification or even a suggestion by anyone to do what he has admitted to. The DA should ask if he would have thought to yank on a male sex organ in an attempt to elicit a response. His job, career & possibly his freedom are gone, with a sex predator tag attached for the rest of his life. He says it was bad judgment. I agree, luckily, his patient wasn't as unresponsive as he thought, this probably wasn't his first time but hopefully it's his last.

The NJ First Aid Council, the main reason I never even considered looking for work in NJ. I remember back in the late 70's early 80's how they fought against even the idea of certifying EMT's in the state, insisting that their "10 point system" was more then adequate. They also, along with the nursing lobby, delayed the development of ALS within the state for years. NY does have its problems but not to the extent that I've read about in NJ. I wouldn't mind NJ becoming a leader in EMS legislation, lots of luck to you.

They are sworn peace officers with full police powers in NYS

Please forgive me for contributing to this post as I'm not a FF, however, as far as enforcement &/or penalties goes why not use Fire police. Give offenders one warning to clear the scene or else. I would think that being arrested by a fellow FF would hurt more than the fine they would receive.