JohnnyOV

If each VAC/FD got out of their little Silos, and started to work together, be dispatched together, set the same protocols together, same training, and actually participate in effective county drills with a good post-drill critique at the end (none of this, good job everyone, heres the free food), then I could see some progress take place. But hey like you said, I'm thinking again. Those 52 PSAP points in Westchester county, and single agency dispatching protocols have been working for 50 years. Why progress now? Hell a consolidation study was even done back in 2001 by the county recommending that all PSAPs be consolidated. http://www.usfa.dhs.gov/pdf/efop/efo33158.pdf edit: incorrect PSAP Number change - and google is a wonderful tool

In FL, it used to be a BLS procedure... not to sure why you would want ALS to ride in someone with 2 minor puncture wounds

Anyone at any time can pull a City pull box, fire alarm pull station, make a false 911 call....

Gotcha, I did a little "google maping" last night after that post and realized that I shouldn't have been surprised. I guess I thought they covered more area then they already do. And I'll take a 6-Pack of your finest Hefewizen beer please!

While I whole heartedly agree, some towns in NYS cannot even afford turnout gear or maintenance on their equipment, let alone 24/7 career staffing. Having a bunk in program like many departments do, particularly in Prince George County, MD, is a fantastic way to supplement a lack of manpower. Their programs are highly successful (probably because of the amount of work that they catch) and students line up to be part of the live in program each semester.

Even more of a justification of 'why are their 9 departments needed." For the non career departments, what is their call volume / apparatus owned / actual working fires, pin jobs and rescues each department attended first due annually? The career departments have pretty much already justified their need, what is the need for a single department that runs 1 single working fire in 2 to 3 years, and 280 runs a year tops? Why not split the cost of operation by joining forces, minimizing apparatus while maximizing your manpower (which we all know manpower really is what puts out fires and rescues people). You have departments in Greenburg with 4 engines and a Ladder, which are 1/10 the size and 1/3 the call volume (0.76 runs every day, compared to 1.67 runs every single day) of Yorktown, which operates the exact same plus a tanker and a Rescue. Each volunteer department around that area has approximately the same size response area, if not smaller then the 4.6 square miles since you have proportionally more, in less space, and each has pretty much the same apparatus count. 4 Engines, 1 Tiller 2 Engines, 1 Tower Ladder 2 Engines, 1 Truck, 1 Rescue 2 Engines, 1 Quint 4 Engines, 1 Truck, 1 Tower ladder 2 Engines, 1 Truck, 1 Tower ladder All those Volunteer departments combined have 16 Engines, 3 Trucks, 3 Tower Ladders, 1 Tiller and 1 Rescue. The duplication of services, in my opinion, is out of control. Again, why are they needed. Show me the justification for this duplication of services in such a small area. I'm gonna have to side with the Newsday studies on this one. There is 0 need for Long Island to have more apparatus then NYC and LA combined. ZERO. For a strictly fire only, zero EMS runs, all volunteer department, I'll put a friendly wager on that . Based off their website compared to others, it looks like they are. Keep in mind, they do not employ any janitors or day watch individuals as well... FYI: this is in no way trying to boost anyone's ego, or shoot anyone's down. All I'm trying to reference is when you drive and blink your eyes and there is another firehouse 0.8 miles away, something screams over redundant...

It amazes me that an area, like the Capt, stated earlier, the size of Somers and Yorktown (both about equal size, Somers being slightly bigger) needs 12 different departments with a full assortment of apparatus. Yorktown and somers are pretty much right in line with each other being the most active all volunteer departments in the county (Somers being both EMS and Fire at around 2000-2100, and Yorktown strictly fire at around 600-650) with slightly less population in the combined area then Colonie. Why is it necessary to have 12 departments in an area that 2, or even a well managed 1 could handle? It literally boggles my mind that 12 departments are even able to fit into an area that small. Each department on average only covers 4.6 square miles. I cannot think of a bigger waste of tax payer money, other then burning it for fun, then the situation going on here. If you want to keep your little fiefdoms, why not keep each department to a single or dual company (engine, truck, or rescue), and dispatch like many counties in Maryland do (Hell this could even work here in Westchester too - OMG BLASPHEMY!). The first due will still be responsible, but you'll be getting auto aid from other departments at the same time. Set the same training standards, the same operational guidelines, the same everything and make it work. Progression while being the most efficient machine you can be is the wave of the future boys. Everyone needs to hop on the train before your customers start pulling rail sections off the tracks to sell for cash........

I know personally for IBM, as I used to work directly for their safety department in Westchester, that they are only a volunteer incipient fire brigade. They are not state trained, rather hire an outside company to come in and provide training on extinguisher use, small hoseline stretching and forceable entry. Their main goal is to extinguish a small incipient fire, rather then try and control a free burning one. Anything bigger then a trashcan fire, they are pretty much under a standing order to back away from the area and evacuate the immediate area. Either way, any type of active fire will warrant the local FD coming in since they still are responsible for determining the cause of the fire.

also from the San Benito County Hazmat plan: SAN BENITO COUNTY HAZARDOUS MATERIALS INCIDENT RESPONSE AREA PLAN The San Benito County Environmental Health Draft Area Plan / January 2007 4.15 Safety Officer's Checklist Haz-Mat Alarm # ___________ Duty Position Responsibility: Safety of all Haz-Mat Team personnel. Duty Equipment: Protective clothing, Haz-Mat Safety Officer Vest, Haz-Mat Portable Radio, clipboard with checklist, binoculars, whistle. Duty Checklist: Obtain duty equipment from Haz-Mat team. Join Haz-Mat team for situation briefing, advise Incident Commander of the risks involved. Read Entire Duty Checklist Identify Decontamination Team Lead and coordinate efforts and any pertinent information with him. Identify existing and potentially hazardous risks and situations associated with the incident. (Be aware of up-dates.) Keep all Haz-Mat Team members informed of existing and impending hazards. Exercise emergency authority to stop and prevent unsafe actions. Record names and protective numbers during Haz-Mat Team donning process. Ensure that decontamination team is completely ready before Haz-Mat team entry into Hot Zone. Ensure that all safety teams and equipment are in place (i.e., hose lines, fire extinguishers, etc.). Ensure that all Haz-Mat entry teams and back-up team members are thoroughly safety checked prior to entry into Hot Zone. Keep Attention on the Hazardous Materials Entry Team in the hot zone. Monitor time in Hot Zone and breathing air used. (Allow time for decontamination process.) Notify Haz-Mat Team Leader if additional supplies are needed. Watch for signs of heat stress or physical exhaustion of Haz-Mat team members. After Haz-Mat exits Hot Zone, continue to monitor their safety during the decontamination process. When ordered by Haz-Mat team leader, secure operations. Return completed Safety Officer Checklist, forms, and equipment to Haz-Mat team leader. SAN BENITO COUNTY HAZARDOUS MATERIALS INCIDENT RESPONSE AREA PLAN The San Benito County Environmental Health Draft Area Plan / January 2007 4.16 Incident Safety Protocols The following general safety protocols and procedures should be instituted and enforced at all hazardous material incidents. Additional incident-specific policies and procedures detailing specific safety issues and concerns will be developed by Incident Command and on-site safety personnel. 1- Safety shall remain the primary operational objective at all hazardous materials incidents. 2- An incident Safety Officer will be designated on all declared HMIs. When necessary the Assistant Safety Officer will be assigned to monitor hazardous material operations. 3- Incident Command will ensure that a safety component to the Incident Plan is in place. 4- The designated Safety Officer shall enforce all policies, procedures, and protocols associated with maintaining incident safety. 5- The Safety Officer shall have the authority to correct unsafe conditions or halt hazardous practices anywhere at the incident. 6- Control zones will be established and maintained to control the risk of exposure to response personnel. 7- Possible sources of ignition should be eliminated whenever flammable or combustible liquids or gases are involved. 8- Operating procedures shall be reviewed by the incident Safety Officer to ensure the proper level of personal safety. 9- Tools and equipment will be used in the appropriate manner by personnel trained in their use. 10- Personnel experiencing medical difficulties or injuries will be treated by EMS personnel on scene, and transported to an acute care medical facility as deemed appropriate. The Safety Officer and Incident Command will be informed of all injuries and events of possible personnel exposure or contamination. 11- All potentially exposed casualties will be decontaminated prior to being transported to an acute care medical facility. 12- All casualties discovered within the designated HOT Zone will be considered potentially contaminated, requiring decontamination, until evaluation proves otherwise. 13- All personnel entering or conducting operations within designated HOT or WARM zones shall be outfitted in the appropriate level of Personal Protective Equipment. 14- Permissible Exposure Limits (PELs) will be identified for all personnel entering or conducting operations within the designate HOT or WARM zones. Entry and decontamination personnel shall be monitored as to levels of exposure. Exposure levels will be monitored and recorded. 15- All protective clothing and equipment will be inspected and tested for operability prior to and following use. A Standby Team will remain in the WARM Zone, suited-up and ready to respond anytime the primary Entry Team has accessed the designated HOT Zone. 16- Only trained hazardous material technicians or specialists will be permitted to access contaminated zones or to operate specialized response equipment or monitoring instrumentation. 17- Medical personnel will be informed of the level of potential exposure involving all casualties and injured persons. 18- Contaminated equipment, clothing, and materials will be properly decontaminated or package for safe disposal. 19- Response and support vehicles will be positioned at the scene to afford unobstructed mobility in the event rapid egress or evacuation is required. 20- No food or beverages will be permitted or consumed within either the designated HOT or WARM control zones. 21- Personnel rehabilitation facilities will be established and services provided to all reasons personnel at the scene. Special Attention will be given to rehydration and rest opportunities. 22- All private contractors, non-public safety reasons clean-up personnel will be made aware and required to adhere to established incident safety protocols. SAN BENITO COUNTY HAZARDOUS MATERIALS INCIDENT RESPONSE AREA PLAN The San Benito County Environmental Health Draft Area Plan / January 2007 49 4.17 Safety Officer’s Log Sheet I. Location: ___________________________________________________________________ Date: ____________________________ II. Contaminants: ______________________________________________________________________________ _____________________ III. Haz-Mat Members: NAME | SUIT # | "TASK" | AIR RECORD: ON ENTRY | DECON | OFF *NOTE: List “Task” above as ENTRY, BACKUP, RELIEF, etc. IV. Remarks (significant occurrences and times):

quick google search yielded this result: http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:6tsI-8grX1EJ:www.pullman-wa.gov/Content/WYSIWYG/fire/HAZMAT-Safety%2520Officer%2520Checklist.pdf+hazmat+safety+officer+checklist&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEEShidGEE-FUt5KWYbDt0u7DI-mQfHRP-lhY10y5Rw5Q0db_oO6tZ3yFZhSSdDUJXpFKoKlGqsCCXYAPViDITcn_c0Fg4zYek6myjy5O8Xtj_3q4tLnd6ax0XXZvmW6nq0jpDIOTr&sig=AHIEtbSiw6oGoZ8XiX46SiZnclq52J0zQQ&pli=1

To the soldier who send that fatal bullet on its way, we will never know your name, the look of your face, your race, or your background. But we all will stand behind you as one, as Americans. You will go down as an American and as a World hero. Your faceless actions have freed us all. Thank you, and you will never be forgotten.

With all due respect to you as well, but I'm sorry, if you cannot adequatly staff and respond in a timely manor you're playing with people's lives. Your community is trusting you to get out and respond in a quick and timely manor. 3 minutes sounds very resonable to me, regardless of the type of call.

What region will this be pertaining to? All of Westchester I hope?

How has your department adapted to the use of Boron and ultra high strength steel in cars in regards to extrication techniques? Normal cutters will not cut through the metal primarily found in the top and bottom of the A and B post. Has any department encountered extrications with cars made with these types of metals as well?

Who cares? Help trucks are on accident scenes to assist with traffic control for us, school buses are dropping off your children to school or home. If red, purple, mauve, blue, cyan, forest green lights provide the best visibility of us or our loved ones, why not equip every truck with them? they're frikken lights people, get a grip.

Date: 4/25/2011 Time: 22:47 Location: TSP NB, 1/8m N of Rt 134 Frequency: 46.26, Fire 17, Fireground 7 Units Operating: Engine 270, Rescue 16, Engine 273, YVAC, 34-Medics, NYSP Weather Conditions: light mist / fog Description Of Incident: Single Car into the median, down the embankment. 911 Caller was the driver, no other calls. Car was not visible from the road. 22:47 - Dispatched to incident 22:48 - 2532, 2533 Responding 22:50 - Engine 270, Rescue 16, Engine 273 responding 22:51 - 2531 responding 22:55 - 2533 on location, confirming entrapment, center median, 20 feet down the embankment 23:50 - Victim extricated (55 min extrication time), handed over to EMS, transported ALS to WMC - Car was a new Subaru legacy with extremely strong frame work (boron and ultra high strength steel). Car wrecked at an extremely high rate of speed, causing the engine/dash to roll onto the driver, pinning the victim's right leg completely under the dash. During the incident, Multiple hydraulic cutting/spreading tools, 3 hydraulic rams, 1 sawsall and 1 steering wheel cutter were put to work. Precautionary hand line was also stretched. Units preformed a drivers side removal of the front door, and a full roof removal. The dash was then rolled as much as possible without further injuring the patient, and it was determined the victim's leg was pinned under the clutch and brake. The steering wheel cutter was used to cut the brake pedal out, and remove the victim. The victim was alert and conscious the duration of the incident, and suffered minor injuries. Without a doubt, this car saved this victim's life. http://www.yorktownf...cfm?News_ID=305

There is so much accusation and assumption going on back and forth between the two sides on over 1300 posts, can any one factually write down a list of what each plan proposes operationally at this point? I'm talking a side by side comparison of what each plan entails?

You could have 50 volunteers at the firehouse, but if no one is a driver, what good are they?

Any chance for this course to be put on another time during the weekend? Having a serious 9-5 job really gets in the way of my volley schedule

State: New York County: Westchester City/Town/Municipality/Dept: Yorktown Heights, NY Unit designation/identifier: Engine 272 Chassis & Body (or Aerial) Manufacturer and model: KME Custom Pump size, tank size (water/foam), aerial type & length: 750gal / 1500gpm Status: Delivered http://www.yorktownfire.org/apps/public/news/newsView.cfm?News_ID=302

You're right, "demoting" your volunteer officers would be a crime. Much like this...

While criminally negligent, saying he attempted to murder Officer Hess is a little excessive. He did not drive away with the intent to end Officer Hess's life. Assaulting a police officer with a deadly weapon is what occurred. Murder needs intent, and I think he was just trying to escape the situation. I could be totally wrong though, and maybe my optimistic view on some people is too much and he did actually want to end Officer Hess's life. All I know, is that Officer Hess gets to go home to his family, and the perp does not; and thankfully it ended that way.

FYI, pace is hosting a rally today... This is what is going around pace today..... EVERYONE: BALLOON RALLY ! "Wings of Hope!" All you need to do, is get a white balloon and draw the #12 and angel wings on it to represent DJ being your angel for the day. You can tie the balloon to a backpack, a mailbox, your car..anywhere that people will see it and want to join! MTV AND BET will be watching to see what we do! LET'S MAKE THIS BIG! Makes me e'ffing sick edit: I understand the need to mourn your friend or loved one, but just because he "was a saint" before that night, the one screw up might be the biggest mistake of his life. I'm sure we've all made mistakes along the way, and some of us, more then others. I know I have, but I also know when presented with that situation, the right thing to do, is not what he did. Blaming Officer Hess should be the last thing on these parents mind. Blame yourself for not providing the knowledge to your son to do the right thing there. Blame the friends who probably told him to leave the scene. Don't blame the guy who was on the hood of your kids car, fearing for his life, and for those around him. He was presented with a threat, and neutralized it; exactly as he was trained to do.

Is hess himself liable in anyway, or is it just the village and town?

The biggest, most progressive accomplishment IMO, was done just before his departure as Chief. New apparatus and returning to red are all nice and dandy, but firefighter safety is a much more important aspect of the job. He approved and signed off on new box alarms, developed by the officers and firefighters, which included that on the initial report of a structure fire, the FAST department that is assigned to the box, rolls with the first due. The 10-75 does not have to be transmitted for them to be dispatched. Hopefully this will drastically reduce the time it takes for us to get the guys who are there to save our rears when the sh*t hits the fan to the scene. Congrats Chief, you might be our senior firefighter now, but you're going to have to move faster then us younger guys though to get that knob or can.