FFPCogs

Someone's unresponsive and in need help. Force the door by whatever means is available. Advise dispatch that entry will be made and have the PD dispatched if their not there already. I'd much rather explain to a resident or their family that I forced and damaged their door based on what info I had than explain why that loved one died because I didn't do it. Cogs

I can't seem to post a link here, so... It seems the IAFC has taken a stance on the issue of career FFs volunteering on their own time. The full story is at www.Firehouse.com in the news section. I will just say that at a few career FFs and VFDs should be happy with the decision, and I wholeheartedly support their stance. Cog p.s. Anyone with even the slightest knowledge of computers please feel free to post the link...thanx

Yeah, there's a good chance the unemployment lines are going to be getting longer before they shrink. It sucks but civil servants aren't immune from the axe when the well dries up. To the average Joe who doesn't think they'll ever need the PD or FD it's just fine with them if guys lose out, and for alot too if they get cut why shouldn't you..after all misery loves company. "Clink" Here's to better days sooner than later Cogs

Certification is the step I offered, because it is a releatively standard means to address one aspect of officer criteria in any selection process, time in any given department is another, whch takes into account experience. As was stated originally any criteria would have to be regularly updated to meet the necessities of the day. Any discontinued or other classes that don't meet the need can be dropped or subsitutions found. And I do agree with Alan that ALL factors need to be considered. As was also stated by some, each department will need to develop the standards that best suit their needs. As a "standardizer" though I personally would like to see them be as uniform as possible. Cogs

Upon rereading this thread I was struck by points made about the costs and scheduling involved with the testing concept specifically and certifcations overall. I can only speak from my own experience but in a department in which I was a member, the FF I and II classes were usually held regularly for newer personnel, and also included personnel from neighboring depts of the city, as these were the standard minimums for interior FFs citywide. After that though any further levels were up to the individual FFs to attain wherever and when ever they could. If the criteria for officers were to become standardized the same concept should also apply, regularly scheduled classes and tests provided by the department open to those interested/selected. Another useful practice would be to regionalize these regularly scheduled classes and the testing process, this for a number of reasons: 1) Spreads the cost among a larger number of departments thereby making it cheaper for each to attain and maintain an adequate pool of certified personnel for "promotion". For testing the same applies, the more departments involved in the testing process the lower the cost per department per test. 2) Regularly sheduled classes afford any interested/selected members the opportunity to plan for them by having the time, place and length of class set well in advance. 3) Allows personnel who may have "missed the boat" for whatever reason the opportunty to attain their certification at the next regularly scheduled class, relieving them of the burden of chasing classes. 4) This may be the most important: Standardizes the training requirements and certification levels of a group of departments that work together or have the potential to do so. 5) Offers the opportunity to those same departments and their personnel for a modicum of familiarity by having all their officers going through the classes together. This allows for interaction between personnel while training that may carry over and possibily produce a higher level of cohesion at an incident. I have always been a proponent of the standardization of operations whenever and wherever possible. I am of the belief that by "reading from the same page" we are all better served. Cogs

Are you guys friggin' for real? Are you really going to do a tit for tat over a fire that happened a few years ago? Or a call going back months? And c'mon anyone who's been in the fire service for a month should know how their dispatch system works. Now I know you are all dedicated and knowledgable members of the fire service,and you can get as pissed at me as you want, but to be frank your embarassing your departments and yourselves with this childish tete a tete over things that should be long since buried. Do all of us taxpaying residents a favor, get together and figure out a way to fix what's broke. Thanks in advance. Cogs

No politicking from me. I haven't seen the documentary, but I will echo your call for all who come here to remember and honor those who have served this country. God bless America and all her veterans To any and all vets out there Thank You Cogs

PJRielly, Thanks for not Monday morning quaterbacking that's a road better left untravelled. It serves little purpose to do so, and truth be told EVERY firefighter and Department has had incidents where their performance was less than stellar. This thread has of late taken a constuctive tone, a continued look forward will only enhance that. Just my $.02 Cogs p.s. Peter Cogliano 32 Francis Ave Stamford, CT 06905.......

It is easy for those of us not directly affected (other than as residents) by the situation to offer suggestions as to how to best reslove the current state of affairs. I for one have been steadily doing so. Fact is though that there are valid concerns, opinions and considerations in both support and opposition to the idea of a "merged" volunteer fire service in Stamford. This forum has provided those interested with a means to express their view. It has also provided a wealth of knowledge and experience, from both sides of the fence, for those open to recieve it. All that is needed now is the willingness to explore alternatives objectively and a determination to see them through. Cogs

Preaching to the chior Geppetto. Cogs

Your welcome Cogs

Ok kpelly here goes, and please realize that I am speaking for myself only. Initially, 4 on at least one Engine for fire calls, same for the truck, 2-3 on the engine or rescue for medicals, plus POV responses for both types..this is what I've seen which as I said is not every call. And since SFRD IS responding as well than yes the taxpayer is recieving full coverage and they are getting what they pay for in THIS district and under the current response protocols. And as I also stated I am absolutely confident of the safety of my family, friends, neighbors and other residents of this district, with or without an SFRD response, based on my fire service experience/education over the years and my knowledge of the caliber of personnel of that department. As for my future with the BFD, that is for them to decide. And regardless of my status with them, barring any drastic complications such as bankruptcy or a mass exodus of members, my belief holds firm as a taxpayer and resident. Cogs

As expected the IAFF views the IAFC stance as "meddling in the internal affairs of the union". It is a shame FFs can't just be FFs where they want to, be it paid or volunteer, but that's the way it is....for now. The IAFC's decision though could be a bit of added ammunition for any IAFF union member(s) willing to challenge the unions by-laws. Cogs

I can't speak on the statistics regarding the number of personnel on EVERY call, but I can say that every call I've witnessed in the past month has been fully covered for the nature of the call by the department to which REDDOG refers. The public (including my family and myself) are well served and SAFE being covered by them, of that I have absolutely NO DOUBT. On another note, As I have become closer to the situation now that I live here, I can see that my calls for unity (you know, those long winded dissertations) among the VFDs of Stamford is not as simple as I had hoped it would be. I won't go so far as to say it's impossible, but there is quite a bit of work to be done to see it through. Whether or not others are willing or see the need (except for a few here) is another matter, and remains to be seen. If one fact has become apparent though it is that for any meaningful steps to be taken each VFD will have to bring something to the table which will benefit all....As a resident and taxpayer I sincerely hope all the VFFs of Stamford who read this work to accomplish just that much. Baby step first and from there the sky's the limit. Cogs

I'm no religious zealot by any means, I don't even go to church half the time..but even I'm bothered by the seemingly Messianic complex surrounding our President- elect. What's next walking on water? He's just a man..nothing more, nothing less. I hope his supporters aren't expecting too many miracles. Cogs

RIP

Actually the statements weren't meant to be partisan, just thought provoking about the state of our nation...regardless of who got elected. And while Constantinople fell in 1453 it was the capital of the Byzantine Empire..sometimes referred to as the Eastern Roman Empire which had been split from Rome, with it's own Emperor/government for some time prior to 450. Rome itself and therefore the Roman State fell in or around 450 A.D. Obama is the President -elect end of story. I don't have to like it, nor do I have to remain silent in that dislike. I fear many of his policies will lead us down the wrong road, especially internationally, and again I am free to express that view when and where I choose. I don't need any "kool aid", nor the time to drink it to make that decision. 46% of Americans feel as I do, not all of whom live in those red states. In all fairness though the Republican party did indeed suffer a tremendous defeat, and one which it had coming. So while Obama is the President -elect, any Democrat should have taken the election by a far wider margin when the sitting Republican President has a 20% approval rating. I am an American first and as such I will support our President. But just as the now victorious patriotic Democrats and many other Americans watched, endlessly commented on and ultimately rejected the Republican leadership so now will I and other Republicans return the favor when necessary....as is our right and responsibility. Cogs

A society which has forsaken duty to country in favor or personal gain, A military which dwindled consistantly due to governmental budget constraints and lack of popular support, a military reliant on foreign aid and private contractors/mercenaries to fulfill it's responsibilties, a society plagued by moral and ethical decay, a representative governemnt for and by the people which overwhelmingly became the perview of special interests and the wealthy, a government consitently plagued by corruption and greed, a populace increasingly dependent on government subsidy, a society which by losing it's manufacturing and educational advantages became hostage to foriegn interests, a government consistently "in the red" with ever increasing taxes coupled with reductions in services, epic fiscal irresponsibilty on both the personal and "national" level, a society increasingly distracted by entertainment and celebrity, a populace blindly following those who promised all and delivered nothing, a previously industrious "middle class" society in which the gap between the wealthy and the poor grew daily..with the wealthy becoming fewer and richer, a society where me replaced we. America in 2008............no Rome circa 450 A.D. just before the fall. Rome rotted from the inside out, and history repeats itself. Cogs

I can understand that for some..or possibly many VFDs the amount of training needed could be considered extreme to meet some standards. I believe that there should be a minimun which is realistically attainable. Now I started thread this with my opinion as to what those should be to be "fair"...personally I prefer somewhat more stringent standards. Like it or not for volunteers it is difficult to meet some of the standards typically required of career fire officers simply because as volunteers we are not usually afforded the time necessary to attain them. We do not get paid to take classes as a part of our career development, so the time taken to achieve a parity with career officers takes away from other major parts of our lives. This is not an excuse, it is a fact. The minimums that have been bantered about here would seem to achieve at least a measure of competency and afford the communities served with relatively qualified personnel. These are personnel who will have dedicated a reasonable amount of time and energy to achieve the necessary levels of experience, certification and testing. Now this is good for the "average" VFD, but as stated in some posts here any "special" hazards must be addressed by qualified personnel to meet that need. It is incumbent upon any VFD to ascertain what specifically is needed for them and then ensure that the need is met. What is acceptable for one may not be for another. But putting in place a minimum set of standards and the procedures to meet them is a step forward towards a higher level of service which many of our communities rightly deserve. Cogs

As we've seen here there are many different types of FFs and departments represented on this thread. While each has it's own specifics in regards to operations, SOPs ect it appears we all want the same thing...qualified officers. There have been great points brought up here in each and every post...much to the benefit of everyone reading here. So I just wanted to take the opportunity to thank all who have posted for their insights. Alot of great stuff guys. Keep it coming. Cogs

No one's worse than that Kieth Oberman and his lapdog Maddow on what is it MSNBC. The liberal media has their man in office, but don't expect any kinds of attacks on him regardless of how BAD things get...it just wouldn't be "politically correct" to scrutinize and lambaste a minority politician Just goes to show that not only can you get away with murder if you have (or "raise") enough money, but hey now the Presidency is there for the taking as well. No need to be quailfied or even patriotic, so long as you sound good and promise the world. It's all about style over substance which, if you earn a paycheck we will now ALL have to pay for. Notice too that the rest of the world is rejoicing...and why shouldn't they, under Obama we won't have the muscle or fortitude to stand on the world stage. Back to being a paper tiger ala Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton times ten. Excuse me while I puke. Cogs

Don't you mean Ambassador Sharpton, or Secretary of the this or that Sharpton...or hey maybe he'll even make Attorney General Sharpton. Let the good times roll. To all our troops ...thanks for your "mistaken" service to and sacrifices for this great country. Some of us are still proud of you ALL and what you've accomplished !!! Cogs BTW..I think that Obama's win as an histroical event is one of our nations greatest moments. Electing an Afican -American to the White House shows that this great country truly is the land of opportunity where ANYTHING is possible. I just wish it had been a more conservative African- American

What's done is done. Now let's get back to the business of saving lives and putting out fires !!! Cogs

Mark, This is another topic which has been gnawing at what little brains I have left. Filling and retaining the ranks. But that's a topic for another day In regards to the specifics of officer selection...to me the standards and process hold. If there are less members than you may not need to fill every vacant officer slot. I know of a few departments that that have reduced their command staff to reflect the totals on the membership rolls. As more members join the positions are re-instated. Just a thought. BTW... thanks for the compliment Cogs

All right...hands up everyone I'm taking over here.... Seriously, there is another aspect to this that hasn't been touched on, and that is the expectations of and legal ramifications for officers and departments. In today's world a large percentage of citizens seem to believe that ALL firefighters get paid and are held to the same standard. As I've often expressed, the public's perception is their reality. As has been seen recently and even in the past there are departments that have had legal issues stemming from their performance and qualifications of their personnel. The "good neighbor" volunteer FF down the street is no longer immune from lawsuits, and extremely bad press. The steps outlined above I believe still allows us our "freedom of choice" as volunteers to choose our own leadership, while requiring all who seek such positions to meet a minimum of recognized standards to hold them. This goes a long way in court. Standards and SOP/Gs have been twisted and used against VFDs for quite some time, maybe it's time to put them back on our side by meeting them to stem that potential tide. In case you haven't noticed I tend to be a "what can be" personality, as opposed to a "this is how it is" type. I have long been an advocate of proactive policies and standards to best serve our citizens, and to keep the wolves at bay. Think of it as CYA. Cogs