dave0820

When I was a call fire fighter in the lakes region of NH. we used a water supply system called the "rural hitch" Most pumpers up there carried 1000 gallons of water or more. The first due attack pumper dropped a 5" supply line at the top of the driveway with a gated siamese on it and a short length of 5". the second due truck hooks up to the siamese with the short length of 5" and lays a long length off the other side running back behind his truck with another siamese and short length, the third due does the same thing. This system repeats several times. The pump operators have to communicate with each other and as one truck empties the next in line starts to pump up. Because of the gated siamese the empty trucks can disconnect and go to the water supply, fill up, return and hook into the water supply wherever there is an opening. If done properly you can keep water flowing very well, but on a narrow road you can run into problems. I know this post is about large volumes of water, this system won't supply huge amounts of water obviously, but for a house fire it works pretty well.

My son inlaw got a part as an extra in Wilmington NC. he plays a TV news photographer, coincidentally, he used to be a TV news photographer. I watched the first show last night, it was OK, we'll see if it gets better. The brown uniforms in the show they say are Westchester count Sherrifs Officers.

I always thought a "working" fire was one that was growing, on the front side of the fire curve, that will continue to grow and destroy without fire department intervention. A smoldering trash can fire would not be a working fire. A stove fire that is starting to involve the cabinets, is a working fire. a fully involved car fire in the street with no exposure problems would not be a working fire because the fuel is pretty much gone and on the fire curve it's on the downward side, it's no longer working. It's burning it's self out. I may be wrong, but that is the way I understood it, but I don't know it was ever explained to me, and I see by the different answers here many of us never had it explained.

My kids are all grown now, but when they were younger and before cell phones, I always told them that if for any reason they were in trouble and needed help, go the nearest fire station and tell them that their dad is a fireman and they would help them. I would hope that fire fighters today with young kids still have that feeling.

And isn't that wrong, on both sides? Aren't we all there for the same purpose, to save life's and property? For the life of me, I will NEVER understand the CRAP that goes on between union and volunteer firefighter. I give up!

I I agree with you that term limits for chiefs could be a big cause for some of the problems volunteer departments have. In a different thread I made a suggestion that maybe in all towns and villages the fire chief should be a full time paid position. This would put someone in charge at a town level to help get the things the departments need, especially money for training. If the fire chief was just a fire chief, and not someone who owns a business in town or has some other full time job, he might be able to do more. I got a lot of flack for that suggestion. My only reason for putting in my two cents on here is to help spark conversations that somehow might change things or make things better and safer, because no matter how long I have been out of the fire service I always hurt when we lose a brother or sister.

I have been in situations like that also. When I was a volunteer officer in a Westchester Dept. That has a paid FF/ driver for each rig and volunteer fire fighter, at a fire I was having trouble with my portable and went to use the Mic. on the pump panel to communicate and I almost lost my hand. I was told "that Mic is for the paid guys only" Later back at the firehouse the paid guy and I had a conversation, I asked him if he dropped and was unconscious, could I then use the Mic to call for help, he told me to use a portable or just let him die. I'm sure he really wouldn't want to die, but he was serious about that UNION microphone. Then on the other side, after leaving NY I worked for a FD in NH that had 14 paid union guys and 24 P/T paid on call non union FFs. We all shared the same equipment. The first due attack pumper was just that, any certified Operator could and would drive it. There were plenty of times that I drove and operated the pump with a career guy ridding in the offices seat. We all worked together, we trained together and we socialized together. That was a true brother hood. Maybe I'm wrong, but the wedge between union firefighter and nonunion FFs seems to be strongest in southern NY.

I'm not sure the Brotherhood is dead all over, but I do see that it is on the decline. I have lived in a few different states and been involved in the fire service in those areas. I'm not involved in the fire service here in FL, but there is a station 1 mile from my house and I often see the duty crew in the local supper market shopping together and from what I see, it sure looks like these guys are eating together and they all seem to be happy and friendly with each other. Again, I'm not there in the station, but from the outside looking in, I get a sense of brotherhood. Maybe it's wishful thinking, but I hope the brotherhood isn't dead and it can be revived.

I've been out of the fire service for 18 years now and I know things have changed a lot, but I am from the generation of firefighter that considered each other brothers and now sisters too. When I see someone I don't know wearing a FD shirt, I still will call him brother. When I see an officer even those that are good friends or even relatives I always address them the first time we speak by their rank. I think it's a sign of respect. I remember when just being a member of a fire department brought you a certain amount of respect. I do agree that socializing with members of your department helps to bring members together and make it more of a brotherhood. I wish all my brothers and sisters much success and hope everyone stays safe.

Well, if that's true, I stand corrected. So that would mean that the state on NY feels that a Career fire fighter life is more valuable then a volunteer's? That my brothers is just total BS and I can't believe you (and me many years ago) put up with that. This does go alone with what I have been saying, Westchester Fire Departments need to become better organized and change the things that are wrong with the system, stop just going along with things because that's how it's always been done.

I can't state NY Laws, but I doubt there is a law that allows career fire fighters to get more or different training then a volunteer firefighter. I just think if the fire chief was a part of the town/city/village like the police chief or the head of DPW he or she would have a better chance of getting money for training. Let's face it, the people running the town have never had to think about or put any real money into the fire department. Who's fighting for your department to get what you need? My guess is when the PAID police chief asks for something he is more likely to get it, rather then the volunteer fire chief. I wonder why some many people are afraid to change and progress, if you don't change and grow you will be left behind.

That kind of thinking is exactly what's wrong with the fire service today. People who just sit back and say "it won't work" Maybe it won't work everywhere, but it would be a start. How can any city administrator or town manager really hold a volunteer chief responsible for what goes on in the department? If the Chief's position was a full time paid position, it would be a start to get some accountability. As far as being REQUIRED to do things, you don't need the state, the NFPA standards is what every department should strive for. The name of this thread is "If you are not moving forward, you are already behind" Your thinking is exactly why some many fire departments are behind.

I think the position of Fire Chief should be a full time paid position for all fire departments, volunteer, career and mixed.In way too many departments the Chief is the most popular guy or the only one who volunteers for the job. Fire fighting and the safety of firefighter has become a science these days. The person in charge has to have a level of education and devotion, not to say that some volunteer chiefs aren't educated and devoted, but unless "Fire Chief" isn't your full time job it's tough to do everything you need to do to make sure your department is operating properly and safely.

Very well said brother, and I say "Brother" because in my eyes, all fire fighters are brothers. Unfortunately I'm not active in the fire service now due mostly to an injury, but I was a volunteer in Peekskill. There is a combined department that has been that way for years and it works. Like you said, are there problems?, sure, but that doesn't stop ALL the firefighters from working together to get the job done. When I left Peekskill I worked for a department in NH. that had 10 career firefighter/EMTs and 24 paid on call firefighter. We trained together as a department, worked together and socialized together, it worked just fine. My point is, don't be so closed minded, Career and volunteers can get along and work together, it is possible.

The problem is (in my opinion) that most people that live in all the little towns and villages in Westchester have lived there all their lives. They assume that their town is giving them the best services possible. They see the shinny fire trucks in the parade and all the fire fighters marching in their dress uniforms. They see the EMS rigs following their fire departments and the marching bands make everyone happy. But is that an allusion, at 1:15 in the afternoon if they need all those shinny fire trucks and all those firefighter that marched in the parade, will they be there? In some cases maybe, I'm sure there are some volunteer Departments in Westchester that do a great job, but I think there are some other that have a hard time getting trucks on the road and fire fighter on the hose lines. If they do get there, how long does it take? Did a small stove fire turn into a 2 alarm structure fire because it took too long for the first due rig to get there? I commend anyone that is a volunteer firefighter or EMT. It requires a lot of training and lots of time away from your family, but it's harder and harder to get volunteers. Many people work 2 jobs due to this poor economy, it's just a fact. My comments are by no means meant to disparage any volunteer fire company or fire fighter, I just think the towns and village governments need to give their people the best possible Fire, Police and EMS services possible. The taxpayers deserve it.

Isn't it better to be proactive then to be reactive? I no longer live in Westchester, when I was there I was a volunteer fire fighter, so I can see things from the volunteer perspective. I left NY and worked for a combined fire Dept. we had 2-4 full time fire fighters on duty at all time. When we had a Med call, they took the ambulance, the "call Co" volunteers" came in and covered the station. We were ready for the next call. If it was a fire, the career guys took the first due pumper, the call company responded with other truck to support them. If more resources were needed mutual aid was called. This system worked very well. Now I live in an area where there is a county wide fire department. The county is 688 square miles, we have 17 stations, they run 13 engines, 6 quints, 17 rescue ambulances, 3 tankers, 10 brush trucks 3 foam truck and a haz mat unit. The medics man the back of 2 choppers that are piloted by the sheriffs office for air transports. My reason for listing all this is, why is it that here in FL a Dept. like this can operate on 25% of the taxes people in Westchester pay? It can be done there, but it would require some people at the top to realize that things have to change. That's just my opinion for what it's worth.

Very well said and I agree with you. I no longer live in Westchester, but what I wonder is, why is it so hard to change whatever law it is that prevents a county wide fire service. Other states do it with much lower taxes. I think a county wide fire department would help. The volunteer companies could support the county fire fighters, but at least an engine would be able to respond quickly. In citys where there is already a career department in place there would be no need for county firefighters. I agree this is a long way out, but someone should be at least getting a plan in gear.

I understand in Westchester county there are lots of small towns and villages with individual volunteer fire departments mixed in with a few bigger citys, Westchester is one of the richest countys in NY and in the US. I don't understand why with all the taxes collected in Westchester there are situations where it takes several calls to get a crew out, Fire or EMS. The citizens deserve a response in a reasonable time. Other areas in the country do it with a lot less tax revenue. I understand the pride that some of these very old volunteer Departments have, but pride isn't putting out the fires or getting people to the hospital quick enough to save their life. I think it might be time for some major changes in Westchester. I don't know what the answer is, but someone should be trying to fix this problem. I know where I live (and my property taes are about 75% less then they were when I lived in Westchester) if my house is on fire any time of the day or night with in 5 Mins there will be a pumper, a quint and a rescue truck here with full crews on each. Just saying.

No official data, other then spending some time in court and listening to the cases....speeding tickets far out number all other traffic offences

Nothing is going to make things 100% safe, but in my opinion, distractive driving is the cause of many problems and THAT should be a concern for law enforcement. We make laws like no cell phone use or texting while driving, but no one talks about reading, eating, putting on makeup or rummaging through our bags while driving. I believe in most states there are laws against distractive driving, why isn't that enforced more. Cops give out tons of speeding tickets, but ignore other things that are just as dangerous. My guess is a speeding ticket usually doesn't get challenged and the fines are high. If I can see people doing all sorts of strange things in their car while driving, why can't the cops? Just my opinion, for what it's worth.

I think this is a great step for the PFD and about time. The next step ( in my opinion ) should be a full time Chief. For a department the size of Peeskill's with career and volunteers members there has to be a strong leader, not someone who is VOTED in for 3 years then out.

I'm in

It was very bad, I got through about 10 Mins and had to turn it off.

Hi, my name is Dave, I currently live in south Florida, but I'm originally from Peekskill, where I was a member of Columbian Engine Co #1. I am an Ex Captain at CE 1. I mover to NH for 8 years where I was a paid on call FF/ EMT for Gilford Fire Rescue. I love EMT Bravo. It great to be so far away from my roots but still able to see what's happening there with Fire Police & EMS. Seth and everyone at EMT Bravo do a great job!

What a terrible tragedy. Rest in peace Brothers. Condolences to the family